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Old 03-02-2012, 11:11 PM   #1
Preston Sprimont
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Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

I've decided to switch, at least temporarily, from CFFB to my own programming. I absolutely love CFFB, but I want to spend some time focusing even more specifically on a) strength, and b) Olympic lifting, and to do a little less conditioning. I'd also like to gain a bit of weight. I also just want to try creating my own program as a learning experience.

I'm pretty sure (or at least I've heard repeatedly) that Louie's Westside Conjugate system is based in the training of the idolized old Soviet weightlifters, and I've heard great things about the conjugate system and want to give it a try, so it seemed like the natural starting point for a program that will address the goals I have in mind. I can't really find much about the original "conjugate Olympic" program of the Soviets, so I'm using the basic Conjugate Westside template and trying to fit in the Olympic lifts.

Anyway, I'm still working on hashing out all of the details, and I don't want to make any ignorant newbie-programmer mistakes...
So, I'd love to hear any feedback on it, please.

Here is the basic template I have for the program. It's still a work in progress...

Monday - ME Upper + Clean & Jerk
- Find a 1RM, 3RM, or 5RM in upper lift (select from: bench, press, push press, floor press)
- Clean & Jerk 6-10 singles above 80%
- Upper assistance, 2-4 exercises super-setted, 3x10-12 reps each (select from: DB bench, incline bench, Pendlay row, DB overhead press, chin/pull-up, dip, etc.)

Tuesday - DE Lower
- 10-12x2 speed lower lift (select from: banded pause squats, banded box squats, banded pause front squats, maybe power cleans or power snatches?)
- Jump work, undecided on reps/sets (select from: vertical jumps, seated box jumps, weighted box jumps)
- Lower assistance, 2-4 exercises super-setted, 3x10-12 reps each (select from: KB swings/snatches/squats, lunge variations, sumo deadlift, RDL, straight-leg deadlift, glute-ham raises, etc)

Thursday - DE Upper + Snatch
- 8x3 speed upper lift (select from: bench, bench variations, press)
- Snatch 6-10 singles above 80%
- Upper assistance, 2-4 exercises super-setted, 3x10-12 reps each (select from: DB bench, incline bench, Pendlay row, DB overhead press, chin/pull-up, dip, etc.)

Friday - ME Lower
- Find a 1RM, 3RM, or 5RM in lower lift (select from: squat, front squat, deadlift, sumo deadlift, good morning, box squat, wide-stance squat, high-bar squat, rack pull, etc.)
- Lower assistance, 2-4 exercises super-setted, 3x10-12 reps each (select from: KB swings/snatches/squats, lunge variations, sumo deadlift, RDL, straight-leg deadlift, glute-ham raises, etc)

Saturday
Optional skill work and conditioning (sprints, mid-length job, sled work, hike, etc.)


Some things I have particular questions or uncertainties about:
- Assistance exercises - this is what I have the least experience with. I am still a little uncertain about selecting appropriate assistance exercises and choosing how much to do. It seems like a fair amount of this is a trial and error process, but I'd also like to hear if anyone has some good general advice on assistance exercises as they would fit into a program like the one I have laid out.
- Fitting in the O-lifts. I went with including them on the upper days (rather than lower) to avoid overdoing lower body volume in one training session, but I'm still a bit unsure about this decision. Including it on the upper days means that I am doing some sort of moderately heavy lower body work on all four of my lifting days. I can see how this could affect recovery negatively; so, I can't decide which is better. Also, I included C&J on Monday so that the heavy cleans wouldn't affect my ME lower day (though I guess it could hurt my DE lower day--thoughts?), and snatch on Thursday because I'll be handling less weight in the snatch, and therefore it (hopefully) won't hurt my ME lower day as much.
- Jump work - I'd like to include some occasional jump work, as I think it's a great tool for training explosiveness. It's probably something that I'd include on one day every week or two. Thoughts?
- Power variations (clean and snatch) - I'd like to include power cleans and snatches to really work on explosive pulling. I'm not sure if it would be best to include this one day a week (or maybe every other week, alternating with jump work) in addition to my DE lower exercise, or if I should replace some DE lower days with power cleans or snatches.
- Rep variation on ME days - I want to include more than just max singles on ME days. I like the idea of including maxes at higher reps (3s and 5s, in particular), as I am training to get stronger, bigger, and more powerful. Because I'm not training for a powerlifting competition, I don't need to focus quite as much on max singles.

I think that's all. Sorry for the gargantuan post.
I'd love any/all advice, especially from anyone who has followed/created a similar program before.

Thank you much.
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:28 AM   #2
Paulo Santos
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

That just looks like a basic Westside Conjugate program with some Olympic lifts on ME days, which is great for a powerlifting program, but if you want an Olympic program, I'd change it up. How does this sound?

Monday:
ME Upper (Press, Push Press, Jerk, Incline Bench Press)

Assistance:
Shoulder Exercise: 3x8-12
Back Exercise: 3x8-12
Triceps Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Tuesday:
Olympic (Cleans, Snatches, Hang Cleans, Hang Snatches)

Assistance:
Pressing Exercise: 3x8-12
Pulling Exercise: 3x8-12
Squat Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Thursday:
Olympic (Power Cleans, Power Snatches, Hang Power Cleans, Hang Power Snatches)

Assistance:
Pressing Exercise: 3x8-12
Pulling Exercise: 3x8-12
Squat Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Friday:
ME Lower (High Bar Squat, Front Squat, Deadlift, Box Squat)

Assistance:
Quad Assistance: 3x8-12
Hamstring Assistance: 3x8-12
Lower Back Assistance: 3x8-12
Core Assistance: 3x8-12
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:39 AM   #3
Daniel Wheeler
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

You'd need amazing proficiency to get by performing the lifts once a week.
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:44 AM   #4
Rob Samuels
 
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Wheeler View Post
You'd need amazing proficiency to get by performing the lifts once a week.
I agree, The Olympic lifts see much of their improvement through improving technique especially at first. Its not going to be so much about raw power as it is about perfecting the movement. You need more frequency and volume in my opinion.

You can always give your program a shot though and see how it works out for you.
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Old 03-03-2012, 12:12 PM   #5
Preston Sprimont
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulo Santos View Post
That just looks like a basic Westside Conjugate program with some Olympic lifts on ME days, which is great for a powerlifting program, but if you want an Olympic program, I'd change it up. How does this sound?

Monday:
ME Upper (Press, Push Press, Jerk, Incline Bench Press)

Assistance:
Shoulder Exercise: 3x8-12
Back Exercise: 3x8-12
Triceps Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Tuesday:
Olympic (Cleans, Snatches, Hang Cleans, Hang Snatches)

Assistance:
Pressing Exercise: 3x8-12
Pulling Exercise: 3x8-12
Squat Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Thursday:
Olympic (Power Cleans, Power Snatches, Hang Power Cleans, Hang Power Snatches)

Assistance:
Pressing Exercise: 3x8-12
Pulling Exercise: 3x8-12
Squat Exercise: 3x8-12
Core Exercise: 3x8-12

Friday:
ME Lower (High Bar Squat, Front Squat, Deadlift, Box Squat)

Assistance:
Quad Assistance: 3x8-12
Hamstring Assistance: 3x8-12
Lower Back Assistance: 3x8-12
Core Assistance: 3x8-12
Paulo, thanks for the reply, and thanks for giving some details on what assistance exercises to include for each day -- that helps a lot.
I considered doing something like the template you have here, replacing the DE days with Olympic days, as Olympic lifting is very dynamic. The only reason I didn't is because I really want to include DE squats, and I think that accommodating resistance (particularly when coupled with a "pause" at the bottom to diminish the stretch reflex) will help my squat a lot. I'd like to include DE upper exercises too, but that's mostly because I think it's fun and like the variety. Squatting and overall lower body strength/power is more of a priority. I'd also like to be squatting at least 2x a week.

Do you think it would work to follow a template similar to the one you laid out above, but also include DE squatting? I'm thinking I could include it either on Monday, and have it be a "ME Upper + DE Lower" day with assistance exercises just for upper body, or on Tuesday, and do "DE Lower + Olympic." It seems that a potential downfall of including it on Monday could be that I won't get the cumulative volume effect of having the DE squats and the lower body assistance exercises on the same day. But if it's on Tuesday, there's the risk of overdoing intensity + volume for that day, as the Olympic lifts are pretty demanding on the lower body. Thoughts?

Thanks again, Paulo.

Edit: One more thing... what are your thoughts on cycling in 3s and 5s in addition to singles for the ME days? I'm pretty sure I asked you this same question at some point, but I can't remember the answer or find the thread.
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Last edited by Preston Sprimont : 03-03-2012 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 03-03-2012, 12:36 PM   #6
Preston Sprimont
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Wheeler View Post
You'd need amazing proficiency to get by performing the lifts once a week.
True. I have decent proficiency, but I'm far from amazing.

I should say, for the sake of clarification, I'm not looking to follow a straight up Olympic program. I don't plan on competing anytime soon (though if the opportunity arises, I won't say no).
Mostly I want a Conjugate strength program with an Olympic bias. My main goal right now is to increase strength and power, and my secondary (but not at all mutually exclusive) goals are to get better at Olympic lifting and gain some size.
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Old 03-03-2012, 12:37 PM   #7
Paulo Santos
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Sprimont View Post
Paulo, thanks for the reply, and thanks for giving some details on what assistance exercises to include for each day -- that helps a lot.
I considered doing something like the template you have here, replacing the DE days with Olympic days, as Olympic lifting is very dynamic. The only reason I didn't is because I really want to include DE squats, and I think that accommodating resistance (particularly when coupled with a "pause" at the bottom to diminish the stretch reflex) will help my squat a lot. I'd like to include DE upper exercises too, but that's mostly because I think it's fun and like the variety. Squatting and overall lower body strength/power is more of a priority. I'd also like to be squatting at least 2x a week.

Do you think it would work to follow a template similar to the one you laid out above, but also include DE squatting? I'm thinking I could include it either on Monday, and have it be a "ME Upper + DE Lower" day with assistance exercises just for upper body, or on Tuesday, and do "DE Lower + Olympic." It seems that a potential downfall of including it on Monday could be that I won't get the cumulative volume effect of having the DE squats and the lower body assistance exercises on the same day. But if it's on Tuesday, there's the risk of overdoing intensity + volume for that day, as the Olympic lifts are pretty demanding on the lower body. Thoughts?

Thanks again, Paulo.
IF you want to do Speed Squats, then I'd do them on Tuesday after the Olympic lifts. You can remove the Squat Exercise in the Assistance section so it isn't too much squatting that day.
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Old 03-03-2012, 12:44 PM   #8
Preston Sprimont
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulo Santos View Post
IF you want to do Speed Squats, then I'd do them on Tuesday after the Olympic lifts. You can remove the Squat Exercise in the Assistance section so it isn't too much squatting that day.
Okay, thank you. That sounds pretty good.

One more question: what do you suggest for the "squatting exercise" in the assistance lifts?

Thanks again.
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Old 03-03-2012, 12:52 PM   #9
Paulo Santos
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Sprimont View Post
Okay, thank you. That sounds pretty good.

One more question: what do you suggest for the "squatting exercise" in the assistance lifts?

Thanks again.
On the ME Lower day, I'd do things like Lunges, step-ups, jumping alternating lunges, air squats, box jumps.

On the Olympic days, I'd do Overhead Squats on the Snatch Days and Front Squats on the Clean Days.
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Old 03-05-2012, 04:08 PM   #10
Terry Gibbs
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Re: Conjugate Olympic Program. Critiques?

seriously there is a massive amount on the Russian system, just take some time and find it ...

maybe even buy some books rather than just relying on google

looks like nothing that you have for a reason
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