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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 03-11-2009, 01:58 PM   #41
Sam Ser
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Re: What is considered fit?

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Originally Posted by Phillip Garrison View Post
Exactly. Again it comes down to defining "fit" as being arbitrary.
out of curiosity, do you have a preferred definition for "fit"? because all i see is you shooting down the idea that there is such a thing. i wonder if you disapprove of the terms "alive" and "dead" as being too arbitrary.

of course, your point is valid... but only to an extent. sure, all definition is arbitrary. but through objective standards and common practice, we can use these arbitrary definitions as conventions that allow us to discuss subjects with a reasonable degree of standardization.

now, there are shades (or is it hues?) of colors that fall right between blue and green, and you and i can argue all day long whether they're blue-ish green or green-ish blue. if you want to argue that a particular test of fitness measures more "blue" than "green," so to speak, that's a valid argument... it's just kind of petty and not terribly helpful.

if you have something more constructive and interesting to say about the things that we know to be actually blue and green, that would be a welcome addition to the forum. if you had a suggestion for how to attain greater accuracy in defining the blue-green areas, it could be an important contribution to the broader exercise community.

but if all you want to do is say that greg glassman's definition of fitness is not a perfectly precise and inclusive definition of all kinds of fitness for all people at all times... i have to ask, man, what's the point?

when it comes down to it, what are your goals, and how are you going to train for them?

if it's through the crossfit protocol, which is based on this conception of fitness that you find flawed, then why continue to argue about it? why not just say, "yeah, it's a good way of defining how to be good at crossfit. and, mumbo jumbo aside, this stuff really works for me."

and if not, then why hang out here?

i'm not trying to make a personal attack here. it's just disappointing to see this useless bickering clogging up the forum.

Last edited by Sam Ser : 03-11-2009 at 02:00 PM.
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Old 03-11-2009, 02:21 PM   #42
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: What is considered fit?

Alive and dead is fairly well accepted amongst many groups. Yes, there are times when the definition gets squishy, but 99% of the time, it is very easily defined.

As far as fit goes, every group defines this differently. What is fit to a marathoner, rugger, cyclist, weightlifter, strongman, basketball player, etc is very different. SOme groups don't even bother with fit, because it doesn't really apply.

Since this is CF and the people who created CF took the time to define fitness, I would say that someone who is fit is someone that has achieved a certian level in each of the 10 aspects of fitness. What level some one has to have to be fit, or how you are going score it, I'm not sure.

I think arguements like this are good for intellectaul debate, but no answer will be produced. I don;t find this to be a wasted effort, but very frustrating if you go in expecting a definite answer.

Since fit is such a broad term, lets start with a much smaller one, strength, a personal favorite of mine. Who is stronger; a weightlifter, powerlifter, or strongman?
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:18 AM   #43
Bob Long
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Re: What is considered fit?

Question: What is considered fit?

Answer: Whatever Coach Greg Glassman says is fit. It's his board, not mine, not yours.
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:49 AM   #44
Ned Ferguson
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Re: What is considered fit?

Alex, Re: Post #11

Very well said.
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:53 AM   #45
Phillip Garrison
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Re: What is considered fit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Ser View Post
out of curiosity, do you have a preferred definition for "fit"? because all i see is you shooting down the idea that there is such a thing. i wonder if you disapprove of the terms "alive" and "dead" as being too arbitrary.

of course, your point is valid... but only to an extent. sure, all definition is arbitrary. but through objective standards and common practice, we can use these arbitrary definitions as conventions that allow us to discuss subjects with a reasonable degree of standardization.

now, there are shades (or is it hues?) of colors that fall right between blue and green, and you and i can argue all day long whether they're blue-ish green or green-ish blue. if you want to argue that a particular test of fitness measures more "blue" than "green," so to speak, that's a valid argument... it's just kind of petty and not terribly helpful.

if you have something more constructive and interesting to say about the things that we know to be actually blue and green, that would be a welcome addition to the forum. if you had a suggestion for how to attain greater accuracy in defining the blue-green areas, it could be an important contribution to the broader exercise community.

but if all you want to do is say that greg glassman's definition of fitness is not a perfectly precise and inclusive definition of all kinds of fitness for all people at all times... i have to ask, man, what's the point?

when it comes down to it, what are your goals, and how are you going to train for them?

if it's through the CrossFit protocol, which is based on this conception of fitness that you find flawed, then why continue to argue about it? why not just say, "yeah, it's a good way of defining how to be good at CrossFit. and, mumbo jumbo aside, this stuff really works for me."

and if not, then why hang out here?

i'm not trying to make a personal attack here. it's just disappointing to see this useless bickering clogging up the forum.
I don't see how what I've said is not constructive or argumentative. But my definition of "fit" is the ability to perform the tasks you want to do very well. For example a gymnast would not define the skills of a CF'r as fit. The ability of a elite marathoner to run a sub 2:30:00 race but not be able to do 3 pull ups would not be seen as fit by a CF'r. So "fit" depends on what you want to do.
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:56 AM   #46
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: What is considered fit?

But since this IS CF....
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:56 AM   #47
Phillip Garrison
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Re: What is considered fit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie J. Skibicki View Post
Alive and dead is fairly well accepted amongst many groups. Yes, there are times when the definition gets squishy, but 99% of the time, it is very easily defined.

As far as fit goes, every group defines this differently. What is fit to a marathoner, rugger, cyclist, weightlifter, strongman, basketball player, etc is very different. SOme groups don't even bother with fit, because it doesn't really apply.

Since this is CF and the people who created CF took the time to define fitness, I would say that someone who is fit is someone that has achieved a certian level in each of the 10 aspects of fitness. What level some one has to have to be fit, or how you are going score it, I'm not sure.

I think arguements like this are good for intellectaul debate, but no answer will be produced. I don;t find this to be a wasted effort, but very frustrating if you go in expecting a definite answer.

Since fit is such a broad term, lets start with a much smaller one, strength, a personal favorite of mine. Who is stronger; a weightlifter, powerlifter, or strongman?
Good post
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Old 03-12-2009, 12:05 PM   #48
Sean Dunston
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Re: What is considered fit?

Can't we just refer to the "What is Fitness" Journal article?

Sorry if I missed it but I don't think this was posted yet -- wfs
http://library.crossfit.com/free/pdf/CFJ-trial.pdf

PS: I posted a link (Post #7 of this thread) to Coach discussing the Sickness-Wellness-Fitness continuum found on page 3 of the Article, but apparently nobody believes what Coach has to say on this matter.

I'm done with this thread.

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Old 03-12-2009, 12:11 PM   #49
Alex Europa
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Re: What is considered fit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phillip Garrison View Post
I don't see how what I've said is not constructive or argumentative. But my definition of "fit" is the ability to perform the tasks you want to do very well. For example a gymnast would not define the skills of a CF'r as fit. The ability of a elite marathoner to run a sub 2:30:00 race but not be able to do 3 pull ups would not be seen as fit by a CF'r. So "fit" depends on what you want to do.
What you are saying then, is that as a trainer, you feel comfortable telling the average Joe, non-competitive (yet very enthusiastic) wanna be, powerlifter that he's fit (therefore healthy...because in the eye of the general populous, they are one in the same) simply because he can squat/dead/bench a decent amount of weight? What about the runner that barely qualifies for Boston? Would you be willing to tell him that he's fit and healthy?

There is a difference between being "fit" for a sport and being "fit." CrossFit seems to be the exception to this rule however: the better you become at CrossFit, the better your markers of health become, and vice versa. Find me another sport/activity that can say the same, all the way from beginner to elite levels and I'll be willing to continue this conversation.

- Alex
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Old 03-12-2009, 12:14 PM   #50
Alex Europa
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Re: What is considered fit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
Can't we just refer to the "What is Fitness" Journal article?

Sorry if I missed it but I don't think this was posted yet -- wfs
http://library.CrossFit.com/free/pdf/CFJ-trial.pdf

PS: I posted a link (Post #7 of this thread) to Coach discussing the Sickness-Wellness-Fitness continuum found on page 3 of the Article, but apparently nobody believes what Coach has to say on this matter.

I'm done with this thread.

We're not nobodies...just (for some reason) the minority in this thread.

- Alex
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