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Old 07-22-2011, 09:48 AM   #101
Andrew N. Casey
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

this is an interesting topic... strange that abortion didn't make the list of 5, since it's a procedure with no positive effects and totally a matter of convenience most of the time... also curious how many people that are totally against circumcision would be for abortion? or for that matter, if they would be ok with getting a child earrings when they are too young to choose? it's interesting how we pick and choose the things that bother us. if nothing else, this thread has gotten me thinking.
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Old 07-22-2011, 11:22 AM   #102
Sean Dunston
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

Andrew -
While the circumcision discussion walked a fine line on religion and politics (both are banned topics on the CF forums), this one is too thoroughly enmeshed in those topics to be discussed here, so I suggest we drop it here and now.
No need to have this thread thrown in the bucket.
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Last edited by Sean Dunston : 07-22-2011 at 11:26 AM.
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Old 07-22-2011, 12:17 PM   #103
Andrew N. Casey
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

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Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
Andrew -
While the circumcision discussion walked a fine line on religion and politics (both are banned topics on the CF forums), this one is too thoroughly enmeshed in those topics to be discussed here, so I suggest we drop it here and now.
No need to have this thread thrown in the bucket.

i understand how some may feel that way. my intent was not to start a discussion of either. nor do i intend to debate with anyone on these topics, either in this thread or any others. if my comments were taken that way then i apologize. i was simply sharing the thoughts that came to mind upon reading other's feellings on the issue.
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Old 07-22-2011, 12:28 PM   #104
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

I am not going to talk about abortion, but something you said did get me thinking. Do you think perhaps we are seeing so much break down from what we consider wholesome in society due to grossly out growing what I believe nature has intended for us? On another note, I think if people were given / had done what was good for them, there might be less problems. Sometimes in health care you concede to what the patient wants b/c not doing so will end in no treatment at all.
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Old 07-22-2011, 12:38 PM   #105
Sean Dunston
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

good questions Bill.
There are a lot of "useful" medical procedures out there too... but sometimes using them only ends up prolonging the inevitable - death, for a little while (be that length of time a day, week, year or a few years).

Do we all value life so highly (or fear death so much), that we are agreeing to (or begging for) medical procedures that are keeping our population alive for much longer than it was intended to live?

Does doing that only serve to exacerbate the problems you have identified?
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Old 07-22-2011, 02:17 PM   #106
Bradley James Thompson
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

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Originally Posted by Andrew N. Casey View Post
this is an interesting topic... strange that abortion didn't make the list of 5, since it's a procedure with no positive effects and totally a matter of convenience most of the time... also curious how many people that are totally against circumcision would be for abortion? or for that matter, if they would be ok with getting a child earrings when they are too young to choose? it's interesting how we pick and choose the things that bother us. if nothing else, this thread has gotten me thinking.
There is no comparison between circumcision and earrings, and it's silly to suggest there is. One causes permanent damage to an extremely sensitive part of the male genitalia. Seriously, what part of your body is more "your own" than your genitals? Circumcision permanently alters both the appearance, function, and sensation of the penis. An earring is a hole that if not filled, with an earring, will go away.
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Old 07-22-2011, 02:26 PM   #107
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

*sigh* I thought we were past all this.
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Old 07-22-2011, 02:32 PM   #108
Bradley James Thompson
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

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*sigh* I thought we were past all this.
Someone was comparing genital mutilation to pierced ears. That's not a trivialization that can be permitted to slide.
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Old 07-22-2011, 05:45 PM   #109
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

you do realize that you are single handedly causing discussion to stop here. myself and other posters moved on and yet you return with this. stop trolling this thread to death.
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Old 07-23-2011, 01:24 PM   #110
Andrew N. Casey
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Re: 5 common medical procedures

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Originally Posted by Bill M. Hesse View Post
I am not going to talk about abortion, but something you said did get me thinking. Do you think perhaps we are seeing so much break down from what we consider wholesome in society due to grossly out growing what I believe nature has intended for us? On another note, I think if people were given / had done what was good for them, there might be less problems. Sometimes in health care you concede to what the patient wants b/c not doing so will end in no treatment at all.
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Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
good questions Bill.
There are a lot of "useful" medical procedures out there too... but sometimes using them only ends up prolonging the inevitable - death, for a little while (be that length of time a day, week, year or a few years).

Do we all value life so highly (or fear death so much), that we are agreeing to (or begging for) medical procedures that are keeping our population alive for much longer than it was intended to live?

Does doing that only serve to exacerbate the problems you have identified?

not sure if i am following 100% the same line of thinking as you or not.... but i definetly think there is a link between a breakdown of society in regards to values and the problems facing society as a whole.

with regards to the medical care, the problem is made more complex when these medical issues are consequences of a lifetime of poor choices. if you choose to disregard your health your entire life can you really be shocked when it fails on you? and the issue is linked to other issues. if the same person that makes poor health decisions (smoking, drinking , diet, exercise, etc) also makes unwise financial decisions and fails to have enough money saved to provide for themselves in latter life, now should it become the duty of others to shoulder the cost of this extreme health care the person now needs? and can all of this be linked back to the decline of a wholesome society. is there a common ground that can be found between people that make poor life choices vs wise ones? obviously this is impossible to fully discuss without involving things such as politics, religion, morals, etc... but it does raise some good questions to think about. and think about it we must. because it's not going to just effect us on the big picture, but many of us personally. if you had to, how many of us could afford to start supporting our parents in 10 years and still provide for our family, continue to support our parents for another 20 years, and still save enough for retirement that our childrent don't have to support us? on the other hand, how many of us are prepared to not do all we can to prolong the life of our parents... or ourselves?
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