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Old 04-19-2014, 09:58 AM   #51
Todd Neal
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Bob Herald View Post
Insulin is also essential in muscle growth. And those without diabetes should not fear insulin.
Insulin is also essential in fat growth. And why would diabetics fear insulin? They need it to survive. Do you know what you're talking about?
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Old 04-19-2014, 10:02 AM   #52
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
Intake controlled studies already proved fat/carb diet composition has a negligible effect on weight loss.
This is my point. You can't explain it. What if the way the studies were done or the types of foods the participants ate made the fat/carb ratio negligible, but when I try to do it, I get fat? If I had an explanation as to why protein intake affected fat/carb intake, I could better understand what I could do to adopt that approach.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:08 PM   #53
Luke Sirakos
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Todd Neal View Post
Insulin is also essential in fat growth. And why would diabetics fear insulin? They need it to survive. Do you know what you're talking about?
Fat intake is essential for increased fat storage as well. That doesn't mean we should fear it.

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Originally Posted by Todd Neal View Post
This is my point. You can't explain it. What if the way the studies were done or the types of foods the participants ate made the fat/carb ratio negligible, but when I try to do it, I get fat? If I had an explanation as to why protein intake affected fat/carb intake, I could better understand what I could do to adopt that approach.
No I can explain it. I explain it with real world results. I explain it with real studies. I explain it with the fact that I have dropped close to 40 lbs while eating cereal for breakfast every morning and a sandwhich for lunch.

How have your results been? I saw you started your 28 days in ketosis thread back at the beginning of October. That gives you over six months on this approach. What kind of weight loss have you experienced? Fat loss? Have your lifts improved? If so how much? Have your benchmark wod times improved? If so how much? If this type of dieting is so far superior and you have been following it for over half a year surely you have some great evidence of all the wonderful things it has done.

I can't help that you have selective reading and like to ignore studies that go against your predetermined conclusion. I also can't help that you listen to "experts" who have a vested interest in selling the low carb agenda and cherry pick their studies. Why listen to unbiased sources who tell you hard work is the way to achieve your goals when you can listen to biased sources selling books that say "it's not your fault" and "follow my diet and you will shed fat while eating as much as you want", clearly they found the secret.
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Old 04-19-2014, 05:18 PM   #54
Luke Sirakos
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

And because who doesn't need some more studies to read...

(All links WFS)

When diets are controlled, macro composition does not make a significant difference

Nutrient balance in humans: effects of diet composition.

Diet composition and energy balance in humans.


Obese people have a higher energy expenditure (this means that obese people burn more fat than non-obese, however, they eat more and thus store more fat)

Insights into energy balance from doubly labeled water.


Increases in total caloric intake drives an increase in body weight

Estimating the changes in energy flux that characterize the rise in obesity prevalence.


Higher fasting insulin = less fat gain

The entero-insular axis and adipose tissue-related factors in the prediction of weight gain in humans.

Insulin resistance as a predictor of gains in body fat, weight, and abdominal fat in nondiabetic women: a prospective study.


What kind of insulin response is caused by the food we eat? Interestingly, beef can increase insulin MORE than starchy foods like pasta

An insulin index of foods: the insulin demand generated by 1000-kJ portions of common foods.


Yep, I think that is enough.
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Old 04-20-2014, 10:19 PM   #55
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

This is fascinating. I'll get around to reading the others, but thanks for this link. I'll just note a few things for people:

- "Recent studies have shown that carbohydrate-rich diets, which result in high postprandial glucose and insulin responses, are associated with undesirable lipid profiles, greater body fat and the development of insulin resistance in rats and humans."

[So... you linked a study that was conducted to help low-carb dieters. Thanks!]

- "The important Western staples, bread and potato, were among the most insulinogenic foods. Similarly, the highly refined bakery products and snack foods induced substantially more insulin secretion per kilojoule or per gram of food than did the other test foods. In contrast, pasta, oatmeal porridge, and All-Bran cereal produced relatively low insulin responses, despite their high carbohydrate contents."

[Admittedly, I'm surprised to see that pasta had a relatively low response, although it helps answer the question people tend to throw out, "well why aren't Italians fat then, all they eat is pasta..."]

- "However, some protein and fat-rich foods (eggs, beef, fish, lentils, cheese, cake, and doughnuts) induced as much insulin secretion as did some carbohydrate-rich foods (eg, beef was equal to brown rice and fish was equal to grain bread)."

[I'll have to look more into this, but I will note that while eggs, beef, and fish produced relatively high insulin responses (that still didn't come close to the top of the charts), they had very low glucose responses; beef had the lowest of all the foods they tested. Interesting. It's worth looking into the relationship between insulin & glucose more closely.]
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Old 04-20-2014, 10:34 PM   #56
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
No I can explain it. I explain it with real world results. I explain it with real studies. I explain it with the fact that I have dropped close to 40 lbs while eating cereal for breakfast every morning and a sandwhich for lunch.
LoL. You starting each sentence with, "I explain it with..." doesn't mean it's an explanation. As I said before, I want to know how getting sufficient protein seemingly negates the effects of fat and carbs.

Also, if you think that my results on a keto diet versus your results on a western diet are going to settle any debates, that's just silly.
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Old 04-20-2014, 10:55 PM   #57
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

Ok, so these pretty much agree with what I'm trying to say as well. Those with insulin resistance did better than those more sensitive to insulin in terms of weight gain and bf%. And insulin resistance and obesity go hand in hand. Makes perfect sense to me, I don't get what you're missing...
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Old 04-21-2014, 05:36 AM   #58
Luke Sirakos
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Todd Neal View Post
LoL. You starting each sentence with, "I explain it with..." doesn't mean it's an explanation. As I said before, I want to know how getting sufficient protein seemingly negates the effects of fat and carbs.

Also, if you think that my results on a keto diet versus your results on a western diet are going to settle any debates, that's just silly.
So why do you keep dodging the question of how your results have been? You give others advice on their diet, I hope it at least works for you.
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Old 04-21-2014, 05:43 AM   #59
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

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Originally Posted by Todd Neal View Post
Ok, so these pretty much agree with what I'm trying to say as well. Those with insulin resistance did better than those more sensitive to insulin in terms of weight gain and bf%. And insulin resistance and obesity go hand in hand. Makes perfect sense to me, I don't get what you're missing...
The second is the real point. They adjusted for the starting level of fat mass and it showed no relationship between insulin and fat gain.
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Old 04-21-2014, 06:58 AM   #60
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Re: Food for one day, how to improve?

Here is another good one (WFS)

Increased food energy supply is more than sufficient to explain the US epidemic of obesity

Nah, calories don't matter.
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