The 405 Squat

[Chris Mason]

Originally Posted by Matthew Swartz

I'm enjoying all the comments, but what do you guys have to say about my squat? Y'all agree with Chris?

Matt, if you don't alter your style my guess is you will have some significant knee problems in the next few years. You are a strong kid, you can be just as strong and stronger, but you need to protect yourself for the long term. The fact is you are already talking about knee issues. Think about it.

[Ian Nigh]

Sam can squat big weight
Pat can squat big weight
How much less will Pat squat if he squats like Sam?
How much less will Sam squat if he squats like Pat(ATG)?

This is turning into a dr. Seuss storybook!
Matt squatted an impressive weight with pretty good form and that what this thread is about. Go Matt! And dont forget to do your mobility for your knees.

[Preston Sprimont]

Originally Posted by Chris Mason

You know the difference in our opinions on the matter, I have squatted with that much weight. Have you?

The bounce makes a HUUUUGGGEEEE difference.

You are correct, knee wraps help as well. Probably 50-70 lbs. Here is my bet, we put wraps on Pat and don't allow him to bounce. I'll bet he is way short of his 800 lbs.

I DO agree, Pat is a very strong kid. I didn't discredit his lift, I pointed out a fact that gets lost on many.

By the way, Pat puts the bar about the same place on his back as does Sam. Compare the videos if you doubt.

Nope, never squatted that much. Neither have most people in the world, but I can still point it out when I think I see undue discrediting and hyperbolic claims being thrown around.

Okay, I don't want to get tooooo deep into this, nor do I want to hijack the original intent of this thread any more than I already have (this is my last off-topic post ), but I do have to point something out.


The goal of powerlifting is to lift as much weight as possible in the given lift (squat, dead, bench), correct?
Elite powerlifters will do whatever it takes, within the designated rules, to lift as much as they can during a meet, and they continue to find new gear and methods to lift more weight (wider stance, suits, belts, wraps, etc). (By the way, this isn't a veiled critique of powerlifters or geared lifting. It's a fact, and I have no problem with geared lifting and such.)
I have never seen a powerlifter squat ATG or use a bounce at the bottom of the squat during a meet. I just read through the IPF regulations for the squat to double check, and there is no mention in there about it being against regulation, so that's certainly not why.
Now, if bouncing out of the hole does make such a huuuuuuge difference, isn't against meet regulations, and is in fact a way to lift a lot more weight, then why don't powerlifters squat like this? The answer is obvious.. because it is more difficult to squat big weight this way (with a more upright torso, usually a higher bar position, and rock-bottom depth), so it is kind of pointless in a competition in which you are trying to lift as much as possible.
If the bounce really does make such a huge difference such that an 800lb ATG no no no squat with a bounce deserves less praise than an 800lb (I realize Sam squatted 825, this is just for the sake of example) squat to parallel with knee wraps and a belt and no bounce, then I don't understand why more powerlifters aren't using this huge bounce-boost to their advantage.

I don't think it is right to say that Mendes's squat is any less of a feat of strength than any other 800lb squat performed by someone in a similar weight class.

[Chris Mason]

Originally Posted by Preston Sprimont

Nope, never squatted that much. Neither have most people in the world, but I can still point it out when I think I see undue discrediting and hyperbolic claims being thrown around.

Okay, I don't want to get tooooo deep into this, nor do I want to hijack the original intent of this thread any more than I already have (this is my last off-topic post ), but I do have to point something out.


The goal of powerlifting is to lift as much weight as possible in the given lift (squat, dead, bench), correct?
Elite powerlifters will do whatever it takes, within the designated rules, to lift as much as they can during a meet, and they continue to find new gear and methods to lift more weight (wider stance, suits, belts, wraps, etc). (By the way, this isn't a veiled critique of powerlifters or geared lifting. It's a fact, and I have no problem with geared lifting and such.)
I have never seen a powerlifter squat ATG or use a bounce at the bottom of the squat during a meet. I just read through the IPF regulations for the squat to double check, and there is no mention in there about it being against regulation, so that's certainly not why.
Now, if bouncing out of the hole does make such a huuuuuuge difference, isn't against meet regulations, and is in fact a way to lift a lot more weight, then why don't powerlifters squat like this? The answer is obvious.. because it is more difficult to squat big weight this way (with a more upright torso, usually a higher bar position, and rock-bottom depth), so it is kind of pointless in a competition in which you are trying to lift as much as possible.
If the bounce really does make such a huge difference such that an 800lb ATG no no no squat with a bounce deserves less praise than an 800lb (I realize Sam squatted 825, this is just for the sake of example) squat to parallel with knee wraps and a belt and no bounce, then I don't understand why more powerlifters aren't using this huge bounce-boost to their advantage.

I don't think it is right to say that Mendes's squat is any less of a feat of strength than any other 800lb squat performed by someone in a similar weight class.

You are wrong, and the beauty of it lies in the fact you seem smug in your inaccuracy.

If you watch raw meets there are people that bounce out if the bottom. MOST do not for fear of blowing out their knees (a legitimate concern).

An O-lifter has to do it because of the nature of the sport. I get that.

You can think what you want, but I think Pat's lift is less impressive than Sam's based upon how they do the lift. BOTH lifts ARE impressive, no doubt.

[Paul Coomans]

One goes to parallel, the other goes ATG. Apples and oranges.

[Ian Nigh]

So the only way to settle this is to ask Sam to squat ATG and try to bounce out of the whole. Waddaya think, can he do it with 825lbs? or more?

[Frances Ballesteros]

Originally Posted by Chris Mason

You know the difference in our opinions on the matter, I have squatted with that much weight. Have you?

The bounce makes a HUUUUGGGEEEE difference.

You are correct, knee wraps help as well. Probably 50-70 lbs. Here is my bet, we put wraps on Pat and don't allow him to bounce. I'll bet he is way short of his 800 lbs.

I DO agree, Pat is a very strong kid. I didn't discredit his lift, I pointed out a fact that gets lost on many.

By the way, Pat puts the bar about the same place on his back as does Sam. Compare the videos if you doubt.

How about Sam goes below parallel?

[Steve Collegio]

the fact that Mendes hbbs 800lbs WITH NO BELT, and bounces and nails the lift is MUCH more impressive than the video chris posted who belted, and wrapped his knees. And Mendes is clearly more powerful. The bounce is a critical aspect of olympic weightlifting, doesnt make the lift "easier". The bounce is a learned technique to use less energy to get the weight. either way, 800lbs is 800lbs. (no rack either, BOOM, mind = blown)

/thread

[Steve Collegio]

matt, your lift looked good. the weight never caused you to cave in. good posture, good depth. keep it going

[Chris Mason]

Originally Posted by Ian Nigh

So the only way to settle this is to ask Sam to squat ATG and try to bounce out of the whole. Waddaya think, can he do it with 825lbs? or more?

I think his knees would blow as he has not trained for that.