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Old 03-21-2008, 09:47 PM   #1
Kevin Mack
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Not to start a flame war but...

Let me preface this by saying that I'm no nutritionist, I'm just pointing out my observations based on my own research. Now for the touchy part:

I've been looking at both Zone and Paleo, and I have some rather serious concerns (mostly about Paleo. Zone seems ok). For the Paleo-types, where does your calcium come from? I don't see any real good calcium sources in paleo, so do you all have to supplement? Also, how much green leafy vegetables do you have to eat per day to get enough carbs?

For the Zone guys/girls out there, the only real problem I see is that it tries to avoid some really good carb sources, particularly the low-glycemic whole grains. I understand avoiding refined sugar, but whole wheat bread? That's a bit extreme. Could someone with a good knowledge of Zone please explain the rationale behind it?

Again, this wasn't written to get anyone riled up, I just had some serious concerns about both of these diets that I hope you can clarify. I have an admittedly horrible diet, and I'm trying to fix it, but I'm not going to jump on some relatively new diet (and paleo is a new diet, despite the name) without doing my share of research. Thanks in advance.
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Old 03-21-2008, 11:09 PM   #2
Steven Low
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

1. Lots of vegetables, fish and nuts have calcium in them. Considering you're eating them a lot you can get adequate amounts of calcium.

As for leafys I'll defer to someone else on that.

2. Grains contain gluten which is a natural inflammatory agent. Not nice for your digestive system, and if you get off it for a while and then get back on it you'll probably see what everyone means, heh heh.


There's some really good blogs/forums out there by CFers and people related to CF so you should check them out wfs:
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http://www.performancemenu.com/forum...isplay.php?f=3
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:28 AM   #3
Sean Kane
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

I just get confused on how someone could get enough carbs on Paleo. You aren't even allowed to eat potatoes are you?
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:49 AM   #4
Doug Blankenship
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

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Originally Posted by Sean Kane View Post
I just get confused on how someone could get enough carbs on Paleo. You aren't even allowed to eat potatoes are you?
No you are not supposed to, as for the carbs you can get plenty from fruit and veggies. Some fruits will up your carbs very quickly and some Paleo approved nuts will do so also.

Eat 5 to 6 cups a day of broccoli and have some fruit and you have way more carbs than you need in my opinion.
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:49 AM   #5
Gorm Laursen
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

I don't eat to get calcium, in which case I'd eat chalk. EVERYBODY i know who's following general commonsense diet advice are fat or somehow malnutrient. I've helped a friend getting his colon surgically removed by recommending paleo to him. He is now free of any symptomes of colitis on 3rd year. Latest subject I've recommended paleo to just told me the other day that he'd lost 10 kilos within a few months. I get fat when I don't eat paleo. I get fit when I do.

... there's just GOT TO be a downside somewhere!!?

Point is, if you fancy you wholegrain bread: Go ahead and eat it! If you're wuzzy about them bones, go ahead and pour that gallon of milk down the drain – and I'm pretty sure that'd strengthen you bones FAR BETTER than powerlifting and sprinting.

There no law for paleo. You're free to eat pure refined sugar the rest of your life! But why doubt it when you can try it. Test it and get some experience instead of just opinions.

And regarding carbs. I'm permanently sluggish from carb-depleation, doesn't it show
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Old 03-22-2008, 02:13 AM   #6
Dan Heaney
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

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how someone could get enough carbs on Paleo
You don't need them physiological requirement for carbs: 0 g/day.

I usually eat less than 100g from Paleo sources and I have more energy now than I did before Paleo. I do eat 1-2 sweetpotatoes a week and some ice cream almost every night but only if my CHO allow it. You need to find what works for you. Instead of questioning it give it a shot and see how you feel. If you don't like it go back to your old ways.
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Last edited by Dan Heaney : 03-22-2008 at 02:17 AM.
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Old 03-22-2008, 04:14 AM   #7
Susie Rosenberg
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

Humans are obligate fat and protein eaters.

There are essential amino acids (found only in protein foods) that we can't manufacture in our bodies, so we MUST ingest them or we will get sick and die.

There are essential fatty acids (found only in fats) that we can't manufacture in our bodies, so we MUST ingest them or we will get sick and die.

While plenty of carb foods have wondering things in them---vitamins, phytonutrients, etc.---we have no obligate need for them. We will not get sick and die without carbs.

For example, the Inuit whose traditional diet is largely fish, caribou, and the fat from marine animals along with a small amount of seasonal berries and plants, do just fine, and have better health indices than a Western, carb-heavy diet. That's in part because the animal foods they eat, store things like calcium and Vit. C in their bodies; you can't get the same effect eating beef from industrialized feedlots because those animals are not nutritionally the same as a caribou.

If you eat a wide variety of vegetables and some fruit, you will have all the carbs you need, plus a stunning array of health-promoting nutrients. You don't need starches or grains, which is what most of think of as "carbs."

Susie
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Old 03-22-2008, 04:32 AM   #8
Chad Skola
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

I like the info I am getting and may just be retarded, but can someone post the link to both of these diets? My search has not be successful. I may just be dumb.

Thanks,

I am working on cutting all these things out, I just want to read all about it also. I am just having a problem cutting out my bread and cheese. I luuuuuuv those 2 things. hehehe
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Old 03-22-2008, 04:35 AM   #9
Jay Cohen
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

You guys have way more patience then I do. You should be on Oprah, I mean that in a good way.

When I finally make it to Heaven, or at least the Grass Fed Beef Farm, the man will look at me and say """You're that former smart *** CF'r with no patience. You couldn't spend just a few hours every day, every week, every month, every year, explaining why (fill in the blank here) is good for you. Instead, you answered, "Use the search function, Google it, Read the Book, or Eat more meat, Do more Squats", so based on your poor attitude, you will spend the next 100 years in the barn, shoveling manure."""


Now off to eat some eggs, swiss chard, peppers, meat or fish, can't decide.
So much great food, so little time.
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Old 03-22-2008, 04:50 AM   #10
Alicia Michel
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Re: Not to start a flame war but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Skola View Post
I like the info I am getting and may just be retarded, but can someone post the link to both of these diets? My search has not be successful. I may just be dumb.

Thanks,

I am working on cutting all these things out, I just want to read all about it also. I am just having a problem cutting out my bread and cheese. I luuuuuuv those 2 things. hehehe
Go to http://www.performancemenu.com/forum/index.php (WFS), click on the appropriate sections and read.
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