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Old 10-06-2010, 10:03 PM   #111
John Stone
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Paul Shortt View Post
How come younger people recover from injuries faster than older people?
wfs

That looks to be a myth. Every muscle is made up of millions of individual fibers, as a rope is made of many threads. Each muscle fiber is enervated by a single nerve fiber. The non-preventable result of aging is loss of nerve fibers. With the loss of each nerve fiber during aging, you lose its associated muscle fiber. So aging causes you to have increasingly fewer muscle fibers, which makes you weaker. However, the remaining muscle fibers function as well as those of a younger person.
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:13 PM   #112
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by John Stone View Post
wfs

That looks to be a myth. Every muscle is made up of millions of individual fibers, as a rope is made of many threads. Each muscle fiber is enervated by a single nerve fiber. The non-preventable result of aging is loss of nerve fibers. With the loss of each nerve fiber during aging, you lose its associated muscle fiber. So aging causes you to have increasingly fewer muscle fibers, which makes you weaker. However, the remaining muscle fibers function as well as those of a younger person.
And the relevance to recovery from injuries is?

Yes, I read the linked article and understand the explanation of recovery from ordinary exercise. But I don't see the connection to recovery from actual injuries, where there's a need to actually regrow muscle and/or bone.

Katherine
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:33 PM   #113
John Stone
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
And the relevance to recovery from injuries is?

Yes, I read the linked article and understand the explanation of recovery from ordinary exercise. But I don't see the connection to recovery from actual injuries, where there's a need to actually regrow muscle and/or bone.

Katherine
I am reading his statement as being about training-related injuries (muscle strain and the like), not broken bones and such. I could be wrong in my interpretation.
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:52 PM   #114
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by John Stone View Post
I am reading his statement as being about training-related injuries (muscle strain and the like), not broken bones and such. I could be wrong in my interpretation.
I don't think it's clear from the original post. Perhaps he will return to clarify.

In any case, decline in performance with age is pretty well documented across all sports. Regardless of the actual biomedical reasons for the decline, it's clear that many athletes believe -- rightly or wrongly -- that it has to do with poor recovery, and that supplementation (legal or not) will help.

Katherine
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Old 10-07-2010, 05:24 AM   #115
Robert D Taylor Jr
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Troy Becker View Post
See that's the thing- what IS the difference between use and abuse?

And what I meant by "it cuts both ways" is that AASs help heal some injuries, apparently, and make you unnaturally buff at the same time. Is there a certain substance that does one but not the other? Isn't the recovery from a workout what makes you stronger, and steroids that aid in this process?

Troy,

I'm not following you around to argue with you There is a clearly established difference between substance (in this case, AAS) use and abuse. The last time I discussed that on this board it got pretty gnarly. I'll say this unless AAS were acquired legally, it would be a medically clear cur case of substance abuse. Even then, it could be based on how much and what happened.
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Old 10-07-2010, 08:32 AM   #116
Troy Becker
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Robert D Taylor Jr View Post
Troy,

I'm not following you around to argue with you There is a clearly established difference between substance (in this case, AAS) use and abuse. The last time I discussed that on this board it got pretty gnarly. I'll say this unless AAS were acquired legally, it would be a medically clear cur case of substance abuse. Even then, it could be based on how much and what happened.
To play devil's advocate- what if vitamin C, or fish oil, or zinc became a controlled substance? What about maca?
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Old 10-07-2010, 08:37 AM   #117
Troy Becker
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by John Stone View Post
wfs

That looks to be a myth. Every muscle is made up of millions of individual fibers, as a rope is made of many threads. Each muscle fiber is enervated by a single nerve fiber. The non-preventable result of aging is loss of nerve fibers. With the loss of each nerve fiber during aging, you lose its associated muscle fiber. So aging causes you to have increasingly fewer muscle fibers, which makes you weaker. However, the remaining muscle fibers function as well as those of a younger person.
I find that hard to believe, based on what everyone I've ever met past 35ish in athletic circles has told me. Of course, the test showed the maintaining of average power output, which was likely lower with the older guys. So... they had less to recover from, right?
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Old 10-07-2010, 08:38 AM   #118
Robert D Taylor Jr
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Troy Becker View Post
To play devil's advocate- what if vitamin C, or fish oil, or zinc became a controlled substance? What about maca?
Then they become the same thing. Heck ETOH is legal and it can be abused. Google substance abuse criteria.
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Old 10-07-2010, 09:19 AM   #119
Eric A. Brown
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by John Stone View Post
I am reading his statement as being about training-related injuries (muscle strain and the like), not broken bones and such. I could be wrong in my interpretation.

There could be a slight extrapolation from the ability to increase rate of protein uptake and utilization as well as improved efficiency of glycogen uptake, but there is no solid research to support this actual effect secondary to AAS use.

One could also argue for improvements in healing time for certain connective tissue injuries secondary to Nortestosterone use (Nandralone compounds, etc.). Given that there is a slight increase in the secretion of synovial fluid, increased rate of glycogen turnover in connective tissue, as well as some modest water retention at the joints themselves, it is not much of a stretch to see why the compound (usually Nandralone Decanoate) is used for this purpose in athletic circles, despite its incredible detection time.

Unfortunately, since 1991, it has been almost impossible to get a grant to study for these effects, or much of any study with respect to AAS use in anything but cases of wasting disease or burn trauma. And while some good research has come from this, it is difficult to extrapolate from many of the newer studies.

Yes, I could post a bunch of anecdotal evidence, but as it really meets no standard, I am not going to do so. I will say that if Deca was legal, I would be on it right now (yes, based on experience).
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Old 10-07-2010, 10:55 AM   #120
Stu Christensen
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Re: Shane Carwin & Steroids

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Originally Posted by Robert D Taylor Jr View Post
Troy,

I'm not following you around to argue with you There is a clearly established difference between substance (in this case, AAS) use and abuse. The last time I discussed that on this board it got pretty gnarly. I'll say this unless AAS were acquired legally, it would be a medically clear cur case of substance abuse. Even then, it could be based on how much and what happened.
Medical definition yes. Truth, no.
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