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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 07-04-2007, 12:50 PM   #11
Gant Grimes
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Ron, I started CF in late Feb. At the time, I was working in a new city, commuting back home on the weekends, packing up the house, traveling for work (sometimes), and tending to a pregnant wife. Because of that schedule, I usually got 1-3 workouts in per week. I made startling gains, and I attribute some of it to the rest I got from sporadic workouts. The month after we moved in and settled down, I started a 5/2 schedule and couldn't recover. I still made good gains, possibly because injuries forced me to miss days. I'm now on a 3/1 schedule, which feels good to me. I just started a black box program and feel like I am balancing workout intensity with rest (which gets more important with age).

(Message edited by gant on July 04, 2007)
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Old 07-04-2007, 01:20 PM   #12
Ron Winter
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I appreciate the feedback guys...
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:47 PM   #13
Steven Low
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Push/pull is a relatively simple kind of workout that is very effective. There's a recent (2 days old IIRC) article on t-nation about it as well.

Basically in a push-pull you group all of the pushing muscles together which is calves, quads, pecs, tris, anterior & medial delts, etc. vs. the pulling muscles which are the hamstrings, glutes, back, posterior delts, biceps, etc.

Grouping large compounds is fairly simple from there which means that with push you have dips, military press/HSPUs, bench/pushups, squats, front squats while with pull you have oly lifts, deadlifts, rows, pullups/chinups, good mornings, GHR, etc.

There's two ways you can go with this... which is a combination of upper/lower with push/pull or just full body push and full body pull which is more effective IMO cause you can do that more times a week. Simply put, when you do a pull workout, the push muscles are rested that day so there's always enough rest time (48 hrs usually) to recover.

I've gone over a bunch of routine making stuff in my "how to construct your own workout routine" thread (w/f safe):
http://www.bodyweighttraining.org/fo...opic.php?t=794

Basically, figure out exercises isn't that hard. IMO I would use all compounds (multi-joint movements like the ones I listed above) because they give you the most bang for your buck. Stuff like tricep kickbacks and biceps curls while they can be used for specific hypertrophy if you're a BBer.. won't be that great for the average layperson compared to a chinup... which works your biceps, lats and back. 3 for 1 essentially.

A sample one I posted (if you don't want to visit the link) is a 3x a week push/pull with 2 heavy workouts and 2 light ones.

Mon - heavy pull
Tues - heavy push
Wed - Rest
Thurs - Heavy pull, light push
Fri - Heavy push, light pull
Sat - Rest
Sun - Rest

It gives sufficient time to recover if you're not that conditioned, and it's frequent enough that strength (and muscle mass if you eat enough) will be added fairly quickly. With regards to adding CF something like this would work pretty well on a 3 on 1 off schedule.

day1: heavy push (if WOD is push intensive, do pull)
day2: CF
day3: heavy pull (switch to pull if day2 was push)
day4: rest (add another rest day if needed)
*repeat*

Normally, I'd always put light days before heavy days mainly because heavy is CNS intensive, but if you're doing DLs and cleans one day.. you probably don't want to be doing squats and/or front squats the next day.


Here's the article I mentioned earlier.

semi w/f safe (sometimes has scantily clad fitness models + BBer almost in a split):
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=B24CA8595E06390506B42ACEE4 D1E9E3 .hydra?id=1634829
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Old 07-04-2007, 08:12 PM   #14
Ron Winter
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Steven........I really appreciate you putting this much time into this thread for me. I really do appreciate it, you've been a lot of help!
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Old 07-05-2007, 06:44 AM   #15
Jeff Northrop
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Steven that's a great post but I disagree about the usefulness of single joint movements. While I agree with Lincoln about the quality of a tricep kickback, you shouldn't throw out single joint movements completely. They can be helpful for picking up a lagging body part (to correct muscle imbalances or nursing an injury), just pick one or two as needed and make sure they are at the end of your routine.

Think of them as assistance exercises. The multi-joint movements will be the foundation of any quality routine but sometimes the walls need some repairs as well, if you catch the analogy.
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Old 07-05-2007, 08:00 AM   #16
Lincoln Brigham
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Crossfit is a constant variety of functional movement executed at high intensity.

Constant variety encompasses the style of workout - inteval work, strength work, steady state work, chipper, blender, grinder, technique work - as well as the type of exercises chosen.

Functional exercises means doing functional movements instead of working body parts.
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Old 07-05-2007, 05:30 PM   #17
Steven Low
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Jeff:

I agree. However, for more than probably about 80-90% of the people, compound movements will be more useful than triceps kickbacks. Bodybuilders are in those few that need split routines instead of full body routines. That's the gist of it.

In general though, the people that know they *NEED* isolation exercises are the ones that also have a large amount of muscle mass and strength already. They know how to train and thus you don't need to tell them what to do. If you're asking for information about training, you're almost 99% of the time going to be better off training all compounds because they will be more worth your time.
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Old 07-05-2007, 09:46 PM   #18
Veronica Carpenter
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Steven, the million dollar question of the day is "How do convince people that compounds are better than isolation?"
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Old 07-06-2007, 05:10 AM   #19
Steven Low
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That's the hard question to answer.

For the average person concerned about aesthetics, you have to lead by example.. of which a lean look helps immensely. For those interested in strength, that's not that hard to do as compounds build high amounts of strength fast. I can lead by example from strength... but my arms are pretty small (mainly cause I'm light) in comparison to other people so not really from aesthetics.

Some people respond well to arguments.. though not as many. I've converted a few of my friends from just talking to them though. You just need to know how to be persuasive like I think it was maybe Chad Waterbury who had the comment about pullups working lats, biceps and shoulders while curls only work biceps. Also, if you can explain why pullups are much better than pulldowns -- increased neurological activity leading to better strength gains -- then you're golden.
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Old 07-06-2007, 11:20 AM   #20
Veronica Carpenter
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Steven, I think you answered it very well. In the end it comes down to a person's willingness to change. :-)
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