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Old 06-28-2010, 07:42 AM   #1
Aniket Panjwani
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18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

I've been a vegetarian for the last four years, initially for health reasons and later for ethical reasons. After reading some of the threads on this discussion board, my health reasons seem like bunk, but I still feel strong about the ethical reasons.

I'm an economics student, and realized that it might be more efficient to support a substitute for factory farms rather than be pure vegetarian. So, I plan on eating good grass-fed meat, and never eating any meat other than that.

I'm at home for two months before I go off to college. I've been rock climbing the entire summer, four to five times a week. I found out there's a CrossFit affiliate at my college, so I'll start doing that along with rock climbing next year. In the meantime, I'll add in some hill sprints and pushups with the climbing.

I'm 5'11" and 165 pounds, which is a good weight for me, but I have too much body fat. For the next two months, I'm going to do a half Targeted Ketogenic Diet. This means I eat significant amounts of carbohydrates only before a certain cutoff time, which for me is 2:00 P.M, and also after a workout.

I have a few questions.

1. I haven't eaten meat in a long time and I have never prepared meat. I've never eaten beef, veal, bison, or pork before. I have no qualms about eating them now, but my mom is a Hindu who would object to beef, so I can't get any of that until college. I've ordered a crockpot, since it seems like an easy and time efficient way to cook meat. Do I need special knives or anything to prepare meat? Do you have to wash meat, or can you just cook it? I'm really clueless in this department.

2. Could you critique my diet?

Breakfast
----------
2 Eggs
1 oz almonds (20 almonds)
3 or 4 fish oil tablets
Cup of blueberries
Multivitamin

Meal 2
-------
Mixed raw vegetables w/ tbsp flax seed oil
1 cup quinoa
Cheese stick
1 cup black eyed beans

Workout (Climb)

Post-Workout
-------------
50 grams dextrose/maltodextrin
Whey protein powder (30 grams protein)

Meal 3
-------
3 whole eggs (hardboiled)
1 oz almonds
Cheese stick

Meal 4
-------
3 whole eggs (hardboiled)
Mixed Salad w/ tbsp flax seed oil

Meal 5
-------
Mixed raw vegetables (no flax seed oil)
3 or 4 fish oil tablets
1 oz walnuts

I don't have any meat in this diet because I haven't gotten the crockpot yet. I'd like to include meat into one or two of the meals.

3. Where's the best place to look for humanely raised, grass-fed meat? Whole Foods? Trader Joe's? A butcher shop?

Anyway, thanks a ton.
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:30 AM   #2
Renee Lee
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

My mother hates using a big chef's knife to cut up meat, but i can't live without it. A butter knife isn't going to work, but besides that it's preference. if you're having a difficult time with what you're using, move a size up.

I only rinse seafood and poultry, never beef or pork. I don't think there's a rhyme or reason to this...it's just how my mother taught me...

being in IL, you probably have pretty easy access to grass fed beef if you know where to look for it. you will pay out the *** for it at whole foods. I'd check local farmer's markets. if they aren't selling it there, some of those folks should definitely know where you can get it.

Doesn't look like you're eating enough food, and way too many carbs. If you're trying to lose fat, I'd suggest stop overthinking and going straight to the anabolic diet. just try to get <100g of carbs a day
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:49 AM   #3
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Get yourself to a bookstore and buy a good introductory cookbook, plus at least one specialized cookbook for a cuisine that you like. My two favorite introductory cookbooks are The Fannie Farmer Cookbook and Joy of Cooking. Either of those will cover all the basics, including what cuts of what animals to buy, what to do with them, and how to outfit a kitchen.

You may find that grass-fed beef is somewhat impractical on a student budget. You can ease the financial pain substantially by being willing to buy less expensive cuts, which is where your crockpot will come in very handy.

Katherine
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Old 06-28-2010, 11:43 AM   #4
Albert Chang
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aniket Panjwani View Post
1. I haven't eaten meat in a long time and I have never prepared meat. I've never eaten beef, veal, bison, or pork before. I have no qualms about eating them now, but my mom is a Hindu who would object to beef, so I can't get any of that until college. I've ordered a crockpot, since it seems like an easy and time efficient way to cook meat. Do I need special knives or anything to prepare meat? Do you have to wash meat, or can you just cook it? I'm really clueless in this department.
Knives are a pretty big subject, and knife selection is ultimately up to the person. The only real requirements are that the edge is straight (not serrated) and sharp. You can go for the Chinese cleaver, French chef, or Santoku knife (Japanese). I've never used a chinese cleaver, but so far I think I prefer a Santoku over a french, but do plan on building a collection including all three. These should be the same knife you use on vegetables.

Just a couple of notes on the Chinese cleaver. It's supposed to be more versatile than either the French chef or Santoku, so if you're looking for just one knife to do it all (thick blade allows you to use the side to smash garlic or ginger), a Chinese cleaver would probably be a good knife to get. But like I said earlier, it's all about what you like to use. If you feel more comfortable with a French chef or Santoku, by all means get a French Chef or Santoku. Also, it's important that you don't mix up a meat cleaver with a Chinese cleaver. Meat cleavers are duller, heavier, and thicker than the Chinese cleaver, and is meant to be used to hack away at meat, which a Chinese cleaver isn't designed to do.

Lastly, if you're going to invest a lot of money into a good knife, be sure to get a good wood or bamboo cutting board. Your knife will absolutely love you for it.

As for washing meats, just like Renee, I wash poultry, but not beef or pork. However, there's nothing wrong with washing beef or pork, just when you wash any meats, remember to pat them dry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aniket Panjwani View Post
2. Could you critique my diet?

Breakfast
----------
2 Eggs
1 oz almonds (20 almonds)
3 or 4 fish oil tablets
Cup of blueberries
Multivitamin

Meal 2
-------
Mixed raw vegetables w/ tbsp flax seed oil
1 cup quinoa
Cheese stick
1 cup black eyed beans

Workout (Climb)

Post-Workout
-------------
50 grams dextrose/maltodextrin
Whey protein powder (30 grams protein)

Meal 3
-------
3 whole eggs (hardboiled)
1 oz almonds
Cheese stick

Meal 4
-------
3 whole eggs (hardboiled)
Mixed Salad w/ tbsp flax seed oil

Meal 5
-------
Mixed raw vegetables (no flax seed oil)
3 or 4 fish oil tablets
1 oz walnuts

I don't have any meat in this diet because I haven't gotten the crockpot yet. I'd like to include meat into one or two of the meals.
Isn't the dextrose/maltodextrose highly processed corn sugar? I'd personally kick that out. You can get dextrose from fruits.

Can you give us quantities of those mixed vegetables? It does sound like a lot of carb, but it'll be easier to assess that if you tell us how much. But yeah, I'll agree with Renee that it doesn't look like you're eating enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aniket Panjwani View Post
3. Where's the best place to look for humanely raised, grass-fed meat? Whole Foods? Trader Joe's? A butcher shop?

Anyway, thanks a ton.
Farmer's Markets. Some grocery store carry grass-fed beef, but those grocery stores are a minority.

http://www.eatwild.com/products/illinois.html
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Old 06-28-2010, 12:12 PM   #5
Aniket Panjwani
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

First, thank you everyone for your help.

The mixed vegetables are significantly less carbs than you might think ... they're all green leafy vegetables, spinach, kale, etc. Nutrition facts on the package they're in say 20 calories and 3 grams carbs per 3 cups, and I eat probably 4 or 5 cups a day.

I don't think I'm over 100 grams of carbohydrates, if you don't count dextrose/maltodextrin. I read that you should use them after a workout to replace glycogen stores, and that fructose, the kind of sugar in fruit, isn't as effective. I don't know why fructose isn't as effective, but I saw that stated from many different sources.

I think we actually do have a straight edge, non serrated knife in the kitchen. I've never used it for anything, but I guess I could start now.

I ate similarly to the diet below yesterday, and the strange thing is that I felt really full, content, with few hunger pangs. I had a veggie burger (no bread) added in there. I think I'm used to eating a lot more carbs, so when I have more protein and fats, relatively, I'm fuller.

I'm logging everything on fitday today, and I'll put it up later.
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Old 06-28-2010, 12:37 PM   #6
Matt Haxmeier
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Do you have the food network? Alton Brown does a show called "Good Eats" which has an amazing amount of information on cooking almost anything. He also has a good show on cutlery which can explain all about different knives and when to use each.

This might work for the knife one...
http://www.beerorkid.com/2008/01/08/...tlery-episode/ (WFS)

If you can cook it he probably has done a show on it.
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Old 06-28-2010, 02:17 PM   #7
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Eat more. I eat that in one meal (maybe 1 meal and 1 snack) and I"m about your height. I doubt your ability to recover on that diet.
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Old 06-28-2010, 04:46 PM   #8
Aniket Panjwani
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Here's everything for today on fitday. (wfs) I didn't have dextrose/maltodextrin today - if anyone has any advice on that I'd appreciate it; do you need to replace glycogen stores after a workout?

I didn't realize calories were so low; I'm going to pick up a rotisserie chicken from Whole Foods - it should last me until the crockpot arrives.
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Old 06-28-2010, 05:12 PM   #9
Brent Eno
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

Cut out the dextrose. You say you already have too much body fat, and that is only going to keep it in place and maybe add more. I would just eat about a quarter to half of a medium-sized sweet potato, steamed, and a can of wild caught salmon post workout. If you want to do a shake, mix about 6 ounces of coconut water(good source of potassium and has some sugar), a scoop of protein powder(your choice), half a cup or so of frozen mixed berries, and a tablespoon of olive oil(if you want).

You definitely need to eat more. Maybe steak and eggs for breakfast? You need a lot more fat, and more of a variety, in your diet: avocados, olive oil, seeds(raw sunflower and pumpkin...), coconut oil. If you are dead set on eating more carbs, I would stick solely to sweet potatoes, no beans. Get rid of the cheese stick and buy some Amish raw milk cheese at Whole Foods.

Hope this helps and good luck Aniket.
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Old 06-29-2010, 06:41 AM   #10
Jeffrey White
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Re: 18 Years Old, Vegetarian for Last four and a half years

post-workout carbs are not a necessity when you are trying to lose weight. If you feel you are not recovering quickly enough, add a yam/sweet potato to your pwo meal.

Go with real food as much as possible.

Since you are willing to add meat back in, include it in your post-workout meal instead of protein powder. Tilapia would be a good choice. A piece or two of that and a yam and some veggies, you are good to go.

I'd replace the cheese stick with something else. Those things are like a step away from being plastic.

and you probably need more than two eggs at breakfast. You should probably be shooting for 30-40g of protein a meal and for breakfast you are only going to have about 16g, plus another 6g from the almonds.

Dump the beans and quinoa...especially if you are trying to go low-carb. It's just a lot of carbs for no real good reason. There's nothing "health-wise" that you can't easily get from veggies and meat.


Definitely consider going paleo. Check out ************* and listen to his podcasts. Also check out marksdailyapple.com he's got a lot of recipes too.


Sidenote: I live downstate from you. I assume you can easily get grassfeed meat and local veggies easily and cheaply. Either way, I"m glad you see you double think your "ethical reasons" for being a vegetarian too. You know what central Illinois looks like...all that corn, soy and wheat. Every time you look at that consider the amount of water, gas and electricity used to power the farm equipment that plows those fields. Not exactly great for the environment. Then ask yourself what happened to the animals that used to live in "Prairie State". Where is the Prairie in the "Prairie State"? We destroyed it and its natural wildlife.

So it's death and destruction either way; might as well get the most nutrition from death and destruction, right?

check out the book "the vegetarian myth"
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