San Francisco

[Garrett MF Smith]

San Francisco is crapflooded with corporate gyms and there is a dearth of athlete/strength gyms here. Other training facilities tend to be pricey (e.g. Ralph Gracie, Fairtex, Planet Granite).

Crossfit gyms are pricey and have inflexible open gym hours.

What does San Francisco need to fix this situation? Or is it a problem only for me?

[Mark E. Wallace]

Not sure what you're expecting from the forum members on this one. Even if we're to tell you that what SF needs is cheaper gyms with more flexible open gym hours, you're not going to then get some sort of forum-led movement to make that happen.

Whether it's a city-wide problem or not, it's your individual problem to solve right now. Perhaps you can be the guy to open the gym that solves the problem.

- Mark

[Justin McGinley]

This problem exists in most cities/areas.

There are many cheap gyms that don't allow deadlifts/cleans/etc and don't have adequate equipment. And there are a few(if any) expensive gyms/clubs that have the equipment you want, open hours, and allow chalk.

Simply put, it isn't profitable to open up a large black iron gym full of squat racks and lifting platforms, especially in a high rent area. This is why so many people end up buying a squat rack and building a lifting platform in their garage.

I only know of one gym within 2 hours of me that has wide open hours, a decent price, and allows real training. And the owner is barely breaking even every month.

There's just no money in it.

[Garrett MF Smith]

Originally Posted by Justin McGinley

This problem exists in most cities/areas.

There are many cheap gyms that don't allow deadlifts/cleans/etc and don't have adequate equipment. And there are a few(if any) expensive gyms/clubs that have the equipment you want, open hours, and allow chalk.

Well that's what I see as a problem. I don't know how many others agree. So far just you and I see this as a problem. Obviously not enough to start any business.

Simply put, it isn't profitable to open up a large black iron gym full of squat racks and lifting platforms, especially in a high rent area. This is why so many people end up buying a squat rack and building a lifting platform in their garage.

I don't know about business or how to open a gym, what the legalities are. Specificity of training type can be well-addressed by diversity of facilities.

There's just no money in it.

What is involved in setting up a gym?

Looks like rubber interlocking flooring for about 700ft^2 could cost about 20k. Yeah?

Equipment?

I'm thinking 2 cages, 1-2 bench press, 2 pullup bars, DB's up to 160 (roughly 5500lbs), kettlebells, thick bar, trap bar, ez bar. Bars for pullups, a freemotion dual cross. Heavy bag, bands, chains, oly rings, blocks and bars to use for vaulting/jumping.

What's that look like? About 20k for equipment?

Extra space with mat area. The total floor area could be about 2000sq ft.
$600,000 to buy. Don't know about leasing.

Locker rooms with showers. No idea how much that costs.

Looks like total cost would be about 1 mil to own. To lease, maybe an initial 100k?

[Sean Dunston]

you are WAY overestimating your costs for a 700 sq ft gym.

for something that small you could stock yourself adequately (with room for growth and additional equipment as time and money permitted, of course) for less than $4,000.

here's a write up I did for a friend that wanted to outfit his garage.

All links are wfs:

The biggest expense in outfitting your home gym is the cost of shipping - since most weights and other equipment are relatively inexpensive, but getting them from the store to your house, is expensive. Be sure that when you are bouncing around the different websites that you keep track of who is and who is NOT charging you for shipping, and how much it is. Sometimes shipping can cost as much or MORE than the item itself.

Glenn Pendlay, has very good bumpers (hard rubber weights that don't get hurt or hurt the floor when you drop them) and bars, and he offers FREE shipping.
He charges about $1,100 for a full bar and training bumper set (182kg - about 400#)
http://store.wfwclub.com/trainingset.html

You should not need more weight than that for quite a while, but when you do (probably only for dead lifts) you can just buy more weights... but this is an EXCELLENT starting point. You will be able to do ALL of the Olympic lifts: clean, jerk and snatch, as well as the power lifts: dead lift, squat and all the presses.

The next thing you should get is a stand or rack so you can grab the weight easily for front or back squats, or overhead movements and a few rubber floor mats to protect the bumpers.

If you are going to keep this stuff for ever (and they will last forever), a full power rack is an awesome thing to have - but they start at about $500. You do not need the BS Lat-pull attachments that most places offer, so don't bother with that. The power rack also has a bar on the front that a lot of people use as their pull up bar-
http://www.newyorkbarbells.com/92563.html

If you just want "stands" for the barbell, instead of the full power rack (they take up much less space, but don't have the steel protection bars) they go for about $240 - but obviously, they don't have the pull up bar, so you'd have to add one.
http://www.theg2scart.com/product_p/fw-7.htm

If you don't go for the squat/power rack, then you will need a pull up bar -- this one goes into your beams/overhead studs in your garage - about $140.
http://www.theg2scart.com/Stud_Bar_P..._p/studbar.htm

Floor mats - Believe it or not, horse stall mats are generally the cheapest, and you can get these at a Tractor Supply (go back to Bako, baby!). A couple sheets at 4'x6' ~$42.00 each should be all you need.
http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/...http:ClickInfo

We ditched our power rack because it took up too much space and we had plenty of pull up bars, but I would say that buying a power rack at $500, vs. stands at $240 and a pull up bar at $140 would probably be the way to go for you - even though it is more expensive in the beginning.

You should also get at least one kettlebell. The default men's weight for CF exercises is 24KG (53#). You may want 2 of these if somebody else will be working out with you, or you may also want to get a smaller one (16kg is the default women's weight) if you want to us that before you ramp up to full weight. 24kg ~ $80, 16kg ~ $65.
http://store.wfwclub.com/kettlebells.html

Pendlay's site also has "CrossFit" specials on some bar and weight combos, but it is a lot less weight, I think, and the savings is only about $10.

When you are doing pure strength days (not a running or MetCon day) you will really help yourself by having good weightlifting shoes. I have a pair of the red-white-black Do-Win shoes. They are great for the Olympic lifts and for heavy squat days. About $90-100.
http://store.wfwclub.com/shoes.html

You will need a box - the default height is 24" for men. You can build one out of plywood for about $20 (there are building dimensions that I can find for you) or you can buy one made of steel for about $100-
http://www.newyorkbarbells.com/1210-12.html

We also use medicine balls pretty frequently - 20# is default men's weight ~ $70.
http://www.theg2scart.com/Default.asp?Redirected=Y

The last thing you'll need is a pair of rings for dips and muscle ups (these can be suspended from a pullup bar. They are not cheap @ $72.00 - but they last forever:
http://ringtraining.com/shop/equipment/elite-rings.html

If you really wanted to drop some coin, then the one big ticket item you don't have in the above list is a C2 rowing machine. We do use these quite often, and it is an absolute CRUSHER of a workout device. The Model D is the best for what we do. They go for about $900, plus shipping.
https://www2.concept2.com/VIA/index.jsp

If you had all of that **** - you could basically start your own affiliate out of your garage. And I am betting it would cost you about $3,000 to do it.

[Garrett MF Smith]

Originally Posted by Sean Dunston

you are WAY overestimating your costs for a 700 sq ft gym.

for something that small you could stock yourself adequately (with room for growth and additional equipment as time and money permitted, of course) for less than $5,000.

2 cages, bench press and all those DB for < 5k? Where?

I figured the DBs alone will cost over $5000. Figuring $1/lb for 5500lbs.

Rubber flooring from greatmats and mygymfloor costs about $50/2fsq ft, so 700ft^ 2 comes to about 17k uninstalled.

Employee pay? 10k/mo? Utilities bill?

Rent. Including extra space with 300sq ft mat area brings the total floor area to about 1000sq ft. Locker rooms and a front desk area means another 1000sq ft. Roughly 2000 sq ft. Does that sound right?

To lease, $1/sq ft x 2000sq ft = $2000.

Locker rooms with showers cost how much?

Utility bill for 14 hours daily and 200 members costs how much?

Membership dues should be not more than 50/mo. How many members to break even? This gym would likely attract gymrats and so overcrowding must be seriously considered.

[Sean Dunston]

okay-
You win.

Good luck with your gym.

[Garrett MF Smith]

Originally Posted by Sean Dunston

okay-
You win.

Pardon you? Win *what*?

[Sean Dunston]

Don't feel like being trolled, that's all.



Peace. Out.

[Garrett MF Smith]

Originally Posted by Mark E. Wallace

Not sure what you're expecting from the forum members on this one. Even if we're to tell you that what SF needs is cheaper gyms with more flexible open gym hours, you're not going to then get some sort of forum-led movement to make that happen.

Silly.

Whether it's a city-wide problem or not,

That is the fundamental question.

it's your individual problem to solve right now. Perhaps you can be the guy to open the gym that solves the problem.

What is wanted for a gym in my area? Is what I want what others want? Justin McGinley though not an SF'n answered smartly, so the question was understandable.

Perhaps I am in the wrong forum on the 'Net.