CrossFit Discussion Board  

Go Back   CrossFit Discussion Board > CrossFit Forum > Exercises
CrossFit Home Forum Site Rules CrossFit FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Exercises Movements, technique & proper execution

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-17-2012, 01:27 AM   #1
Barry Corcoran
Member Barry Corcoran is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dublin  Ireland
Posts: 96
Bar Muscle up, which way

Ok,

So Ive seen a couple way to do a bar muscle up, I started doing mine,
like this,

jump up grab the bar (without fasle grip) let your momentum take you forward, and as that natural swing takes (swings) you backward pull hard and explosively bring your knees up for extra momentum, pulling your self up and over the bar,stay on bar swing back down and repeat,

While watching, Chris Spealers bar muscle effieciancy tips on the bar with Matt Chan, Chan does a more like kippling pull up movement to initiate the movement, i.e
pushing on bar head forward through arms out front- legs out the back, pulls bar to belly buttom peak for his toes,

but heres my question, finally , whats Chan doing with his legs, is he diving his knees(legs upwards as he moves back as i mentioned above the first way or is he snapping the hips like you woukld in a kip pull up to get height, or is he mearly pulling bar to belly and then peaking for his toes without any consious movemnt of the legs (hip) etc.

Spealer talks about pull bar to belly and turning over elows etc but doesnt mention what the legs and hips are doing.

any help would be great
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2012, 07:04 AM   #2
Erik Glynn
Affiliate Erik Glynn is offline
 
Erik Glynn's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tuscaloosa  AL
Posts: 411
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

In regards to your hips, thrust them towards the bar. Kick your legs up (keep your legs together, more concentrated core) and try to get your body horizontal to the ground, simultaneously thrusting your hips toward the bar. Then explode and throw your chest over the bar as soon as your hips reach max height (peak of the thrust and a sense of weightlessness is achieved).

The way you said 'peaking for your toes' is a good way to put it. I believe Chris called it 'the worlds biggest sit up' when you throw your body over, and that's exactly what it is, when your getting on top of the bar. You have to be quick once you hips are the max height.

Watch a video of the gymnastics un-even bars and you'll see that their legs are always together...they do roughly 20 bar muscle ups in one routine. Great way to see an expert do it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUbUDh0eSlE WFS
__________________
A manís health can be judged by which he takes two at a time Ė pills or stairs. http://www.alabamacrossfit.com

Last edited by Erik Glynn; 07-17-2012 at 07:11 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2012, 09:02 AM   #3
Barry Corcoran
Member Barry Corcoran is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dublin  Ireland
Posts: 96
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

Thanks Eric,

So Basically your trying to get your hips high up close to the bar with legs close together before doing the biggest sit up you can to get over the bar.
Sounds simple.



When you said kick your legs up, what did you mean by that,

there is no snapping of the hips r?ight like yu would see when they break down a kip by lying on the floor on thier back and stomp both feet on the ground (snappin)
I just want to eliminate that doesnt happen here.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2012, 10:11 AM   #4
Erik Glynn
Affiliate Erik Glynn is offline
 
Erik Glynn's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tuscaloosa  AL
Posts: 411
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

I did do that drill when I was first learning the bar muscle up, and it will probably help to get the height needed to turn over the bar. I think I still do the kick with my legs to get my hips up high enough/lots of momentum.

Watch heat 4 of the Track Triplet. Specifically: their final set of bar muscle ups when the athletes are exhausted. That will be your most efficient muscle up path. Once your body gets tired, it eliminates all that excess movement and you'll only do what's necessary. Sports psychology stuff...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqIio...ure=plpp_video WFS
__________________
A manís health can be judged by which he takes two at a time Ė pills or stairs. http://www.alabamacrossfit.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2012, 11:48 PM   #5
Blair Robert Lowe
Member Blair Robert Lowe is offline
 
Blair Robert Lowe's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sacramento  CA
Posts: 7,948
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

1. To clear up, no Men's Gymnastic HB routine or Female UB routine would have the equivalent of 20 Bar MU. I understand what you are trying to get at but...you are allowed 10 countable elements. Any more is just extra work and possibly deductions for skill repetition or empty swings. You might see 3 glide/long hang kips of some sort at most. Maybe 4 for the women. Very rare for the men since they just have one rail.

2. I thought about playing with Bar MU, Ahmik Jones style about a week ago but my hands didn't like the idea.

In anycase, I would envision ideal Bar MU form as not using a false grip because it's a pain in the butt to maintain in a swing on a bar. It's doable if you are frick'n strong but are mostly going to be from a deadhang. When time is on the clock, you'll probably want to just use a kipping form.

I envision the kip as something that would go like this. Lift toes to L, then kick back to arch and snap toes to the bar like a Kipping ToesToBar. As you do so, initate a gymnastics kip action. Bend arms if you have to.

Notice most CFG competitors just shoot their knees up. You probably don't have to lift the toes all the way to bar, just above horizontal to make the body weightless as you pullup hard into the dip transition.

To note, Ahmik Jones of Rogue did his with straight arms. This was some years back, 5-7 but I thought he did like 40 in a row. Insane. For whatever reason, those gymnasts amongst called this a Russian Kip. Basically deadhang kip using a Tap action.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2012, 03:09 AM   #6
Barry Corcoran
Member Barry Corcoran is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dublin  Ireland
Posts: 96
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

Cheers all, going to have a blast tonight,
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2012, 08:12 AM   #7
Barry Corcoran
Member Barry Corcoran is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dublin  Ireland
Posts: 96
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

no look the otehr night, arched and hollowed to initaite swing, got height enough to see the bar, then tried to drive hips to bar and sit up over but nothing, didnt even get close,felt wrong,

did everything dusty highland said to do in his mastering the muscle up video,

How high do you have to be in air before you pull hip to bar,

dusty says when you see the bar arch hips to bar and the turn over,but it just doesnt see to fire at all
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 09:50 PM   #8
Jack Yee
Member Jack Yee is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Santa Monica  CA
Posts: 162
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

Great question! I had the same question myself. I live in Santa Monica and watch a lot of people do BMU. They do it like how you described first - swing and pull on the backswing. After watching the games, I noticed too that just about all the competeters were doing an extreme kipping pullup with a violent drive over the bar. Yes, most seemed to be kicking forward, however, it is not a consious effort to kick forward. When ever I tried to kick forward, it threw my rythmn off.

You are correct that it is more a fast snap or open and closing of the hips. For me, I throw my knees up and quickly snap or open my hips. It looks like I'm stepping down and not kicking forward. However, I would advice not think of stepping down (or stepping on brake motion) because you will use your legs instead of your hips. The power is in the snapping or closing/opening of the hips.

Without the opening of the hips, I am to pull to my stomack. When I add the snapping motion of the opening of the hip, I am able to pull to inches below my belly button.

Try both kips - kippping and kicking forward or kipping and kicking down (again, think more of hips opening than kicking down). You will notice a huge difference of getting height over the bar. From there, you drive your shoulders over and your over the bar.

I hope this makes sense. If not, ask again.

Love this thread!
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2012, 08:28 AM   #9
Barry Corcoran
Member Barry Corcoran is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dublin  Ireland
Posts: 96
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

Nice reply Jack, Im glad someone esle picked up on this,

Ive since had a look at fronning doing some at the end of the muscle up split snatch event, you get to see him do a nice few in a row,

Heres what i noticed

he grabs the bar, get his swing going and as he comes back he bring his knees up (must be for momentum)

so after he brings knees up and gets his height is he snapping opening the hips while pull over?, it happens so fast at this stage you know.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2012, 09:05 AM   #10
Jack Yee
Member Jack Yee is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Santa Monica  CA
Posts: 162
Re: Bar Muscle up, which way

Hello Barry: Again, I love this thread because the way the CF do bar muscle ups is well different than how people do it at beach. In terms of Fronning, yes, when he drives his knees up, he quickly snaps hips back while at the same time, he drives his shoulders over the bar. The fact that you can't see it is a strong example as how fast and explosive you must be to drive shoulder over the bar. For me, the explosive speed is always what is missing when I miss doing a bar MU>

I learned how to do when with your first description - swing, pull back on at your hightest point and roll over. If you got on youtube and do a serach on how to do bar mu, you will see most of the tuturial where guys I doing this way. Noticed how they drive their knees up WITHOUT snapping hips down. The knees up is only HALF of the power. The real power is when you snap and open up the hips.

I sort of combined this method and how the CF did them at the games with the opening and closoing of the hip IE - the drill you described to do a kipping pulling.

To do a bar muscle up, it best to learn by progressions. Here is a simple breakdown:
1. Practice the swing. The momentium is what will you develope speed to get over bar.
2. On then backswing, pull as hard as you can toward your belly. You probably won't hit the stomach, but this is your target goal.
3. On then backswing, pull as hard as you can toward your belly and add ONLY the driving of your knees. When you can do this comfortable, move to the next step.
4. On then backswing, pull as hard as you can toward your belly and add driving of the knees (or closing of hips) and now reopen the hips as fast and violently as you can. It should send you flying in the air! Just do this a couple of times til you get really comfortable and make sure you always are able to hit your belly button. Don't move to the final step till you can do this consistently. Do a lot of single sets and no reps yet.
5. Now do everything and add the aggressive shoulder drive over the bar.

Let me know it goes! You'll be flying over the bar very soon!

Last edited by Jack Yee; 07-23-2012 at 09:07 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
bar muscle ups on rogue dirty south bar? Ian Nigh Equipment 1 01-12-2011 09:15 AM
bar muscle-up Joe Shininger Testimonials 4 02-06-2008 12:30 PM
BAR Muscle-ups Equivalent to RING Muscle-ups? Greg Varga Exercises 20 12-03-2007 06:49 PM
Bar Muscle up Luke Rossmo Testimonials 5 09-25-2007 06:41 PM
Bar Muscle Up Alexander Karatis Exercises 11 08-31-2005 03:50 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:20 AM.


CrossFit is a registered trademark of CrossFit Inc.