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Old 01-24-2011, 12:46 PM   #1
Larry Duncan
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nutrition question for strength training

Ok I am 33 YO Male, I started doing crossfit in Oct of 2009 and loved it in Jan 09 I stalled out and became very focused on my nutrition at the time I was 6'1" and 310 pounds using zone/paleo I dropped to 240lbs very quickly and dropped several inches off of my waist and chest. In July of 2010 I opened my own restaurant and pretty much all physical activity came to an end 15 hour days six days a week and very poor nutrition made recovering from a workout impossible. So I am looking to get started again in the coming week and I thought I would start with this hybrid program for three months or so before going back to pure MP wods. https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&p...CI6VmcwL&pli=1 (WFS) it seems to meet all of my short term goals while providing me the strength base I would like to have.

So my question is this, for some one my size should I take the same 70's big /SS approach ( eat anything you can catch ) that would be recomended for a smaller person looking to gain size and strength or should I tone it down a little to prevent building too much excess fat which causes me other problems as well, ie. joint pain, breathing problems and such.

any advice or direction would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 01-24-2011, 01:02 PM   #2
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

If you run your own restaurant, why is your nutrition so poor?

If you're not trying to gain size, then no, you shouldn't eat as much as someone who is.

Katherine
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Old 01-24-2011, 01:10 PM   #3
Larry Duncan
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
If you run your own restaurant, why is your nutrition so poor?

If you're not trying to gain size, then no, you shouldn't eat as much as someone who is.

Katherine
thanks for the speedy reply.
as for the nutrition my day usually goes as follows up at 6 am breakfast for me the wife and kids. out the door by 9, work at nine thirty. I usually get about ten minutes between 3:30 and 4:00pm for lunch then its dinner service clean up and paperwork until about ten pm. then home for a shower laundry or whatever else needs to be done around the house and if I am lucky I can squeeze in a snack between 10 pm and midnight before I start over again. but due to circumstance beyond my control, ( my investor is pulling out and the landlord found a buyer for our building) I will be on a much more normal schedule after next month.

and I guess I didnt state my question correctly is there any real point in running a strength based program if I am not going to eat like an undersized teenager would or would I just be spinning my wheels.

thanks
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Old 01-24-2011, 02:26 PM   #4
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

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Originally Posted by Larry Duncan View Post
and I guess I didnt state my question correctly is there any real point in running a strength based program if I am not going to eat like an undersized teenager would or would I just be spinning my wheels.
Sure. Competitive weightlifters and powerlifters have weight classes to worry about. They don't necessarily eat like undersized teenagers, either. A large fraction of strength gains comes from improved muscle recruitment, not increased mass.

You explained why your meals are time-constrained, but not why they are quality-constrained. A hard-boiled egg and some fruit don't take any longer to eat than a Twinkie and a Coke.

Katherine
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Old 01-24-2011, 04:04 PM   #5
Joe Bernard
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

What kind of restaurant is it and what do you do while there? I know how demanding the restaurant business is through friends, but eating healthy should not be that hard. I worked at a bagel and coffee shop two summers ago, and did not eat one bagel (don't even like them) the whole time. If anything, you can cook something for yourself to have for lunch if it's not crowded before your break. Also, this is where cooking a bunch of food on one day to have for the rest of the week helps alot.
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Old 01-24-2011, 05:01 PM   #6
Larry Duncan
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

Ok well it seems through my inability to communicate my question clearly we have taken a left turn.


Joe, It is a 160 seat steakhouse of which I am the chef/owner/ dishwasher/janitor/ clerk/ secretary and gopher. And while I have tried to keep the meals that I do get as paleo as possible I still have not had the time to fit a workout into my days.

But what has transpired over the last 7 months is not truly what my question was about so let me rephrase it a little.

I am going to get back to training as quickly as I can get my home gym put back in order and functional again, Probably a week from now. Now I know that by going Zone/Paleo I will see drastic health benefits and very quick loss of this extra body fat I am carrying around. I am also aware that not eating/resting enough will cause a linear strength program such as the one I linked to above to be less effective.

So what I am looking for is if anyone has had any personal experience training someone who is overweight with S&C program like the one I linked earlier who chose to go strict Paleo or Zone/Paleo. And what kind of results did they see. And were they able to make real strength gains while eating this way. Or would I be better off eating like crazy and attaining my strength goals and then worrying about shaving off the excess body fat after I have achieved those goals.

Again thanks for all the input and questions.
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Old 01-24-2011, 05:43 PM   #7
Larry Duncan
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
Sure. Competitive weightlifters and powerlifters have weight classes to worry about. They don't necessarily eat like undersized teenagers, either. A large fraction of strength gains comes from improved muscle recruitment, not increased mass.

You explained why your meals are time-constrained, but not why they are quality-constrained. A hard-boiled egg and some fruit don't take any longer to eat than a Twinkie and a Coke.

Katherine
Katherine, normally my breakfast consists of eggs, and fruit or yogurt and then whatever meal I can eek out during the day is usually a piece of grilled chicken and a quick salad my point was more that I had not been getting near enough food and or sleep to recover so my work outs got put to the side during this period.
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Old 01-24-2011, 07:47 PM   #8
Joe Bernard
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

I definitely understand about not fitting a workout in the day given how busy you are with that size of a restaurant. The guys at 70s big have talked about this before, I think it was the subject of a post for a day but I'm not sure. I do know that it was talked about in the comment section of the Food FAQ, so you could check there first. They basically said that you can gain strength while eating a paleo or paleo/zone (whatever you do) on the program and not gain weight/slim down, but just don't try to starve yourself. Eat to satiety, lift heavy, and the rest will fall into place. I know some people here have seen significant strength increases with little to no weight gain, so hopefully they chime in. Also, you will gain a good amount of strength just from what Katherine said, improved muscle recruitment, so you don't have to gorge yourself just to realize increased strength.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:41 PM   #9
Larry Duncan
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

thanks Joe I dug a little deeper into 70s big and I think I found a good spot from which to start. But I am certainly still open to anyones questions, comments, commands, demands, theories, philosophies or reasonable facsimiles thereof.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:49 PM   #10
Michael Dries
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Re: nutrition question for strength training

Larry, I've done most of what you're talking about doing. I was over weight, off the couch and wanted to get stronger/bigger and lean out.

Let me say you can do both... to a degree. You will NOT see maximal strength gains on a calorie restricted diet and you will NOT see maximal fat loss if you are eating to get strong.

If you haven't been training for a while you could probably ride the "novice effect" and see strength increase while loosing body fat on a calorie restricted diet. Eventually you'll hit a wall, either with strength progress or fat loss. And at that point you have to choose which is the priority.

So to answer your question, yes you can do both on a paleo/zone diet... To a point, then you have to decide which is more important, another 50lbs on your squat or your abs.

The important things are consistency with your lifting and eating.
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