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Old 11-30-2013, 07:45 PM   #41
Mark E. Wallace
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

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Originally Posted by Brian Strump View Post
Sometimes I wish I could sit down with people that post on this board, and just talk to them for a minute; and be thankful I have common sense.
Except for that sitting down with *some* of the people on this board (perhaps myself included) would demonstrate a total *lack* of common sense.

- Mark
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Old 11-30-2013, 07:47 PM   #42
Brian Strump
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

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Originally Posted by Mark E. Wallace View Post
Except for that sitting down with *some* of the people on this board (perhaps myself included) would demonstrate a total *lack* of common sense.

- Mark
Touche.
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Old 12-01-2013, 11:03 AM   #43
Robert D Taylor Jr
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

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Originally Posted by Matt Thomas View Post
Hi Shang. Still no refund I see?
My first thought as well.
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Old 12-01-2013, 11:33 AM   #44
Joe Gomez
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

Billy, I will take care of the bill for you. I found out a couple weeks ago that I had family in Nigeria who left me a lot of money. I'm just waiting for the money and I will help you out.
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Old 12-02-2013, 01:04 PM   #45
Mark E. Wallace
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

I'll pitch in as well. I'm expecting to hear from Publisher's Clearing House at any moment.

- Mark
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Old 12-02-2013, 06:44 PM   #46
Will Seavey
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

There is an objective way to evaluate if a drug caused an adverse drug reaction, called the Naranjo Algorithm. It isn't perfect, but it is used in most medical literature. I have limited knowledge of the case, but I will take a stab at scoring it anyway.

1. Are there previous conclusive reports on this reaction?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
2. Did the adverse events appear after the suspected drug was given?
Yes (+2) No (-1) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a +2
3. Did the adverse reaction improve when the drug was discontinued or a specific antagonist was given?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a +1
4. Did the adverse reaction appear when the drug was readministered?
Yes (+2) No (-1) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
5. Are there alternative causes that could have caused the reaction?
Yes (-1) No (+2) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a -1
6. Did the reaction reappear when a placebo was given?
Yes (-1) No (+1) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
7. Was the drug detected in any body fluid in toxic concentrations?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
8. Was the reaction more severe when the dose was increased, or less severe when the dose was decreased?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
9. Did the patient have a similar reaction to the same or similar drugs in any previous exposure?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a 0
10. Was the adverse event confirmed by any objective evidence?
Yes (+1) No (0) Do not know or not done (0)
I will score a +1 (elevated CK)

Scores to a 3:
Scoring
≥ 9 = definite ADR
5-8 = probable ADR
1-4 = possible ADR
0 = doubtful ADR

So, you are in the possible range. Most reactions score in the probable range unless the drug is given again, which is rare. I think it is much more likely that your work-out caused your rhabdo, the drug could have possibly contributed, but unlikely. Most practicing physicians (>99.9%) don't know squat about dietary supplements mostly because hardly anybody knows anything truly scientific about most (not all) supplements.

If you are truly worried about reactions happening to other people or pattern that may pop-up, report your case to the FDA through the FDA Adverse Event Reporting System. If there actually is a problem with a supplement it is found through this reporting system. If it is just a fluke, no harm done by reporting a possible reaction (although exceedingly unlikely). Here is a WFS link to the program FAERS.
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Old 12-03-2013, 10:57 PM   #47
Jose Cabello
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

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Originally Posted by Matt Thomas View Post
Hi Shang. Still no refund I see?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert D Taylor Jr View Post
My first thought as well.
Mine too
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:19 AM   #48
Luke Sirakos
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

This is so good.

I was squatting and pulled my quad, I just so happened to be taking Nitrean, Chris, will you pay for my PT bills? Thanks.
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Old 12-06-2013, 09:07 PM   #49
Robert Fabsik
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Re: At Large Nutrition (ALN) - Results & Opticen

Ridiculous claim and ridiculous place to search for some type of compensation/closure.

There is a saying in medicine "When you hear hoof beats, think horses not zebras."

Clearly the exercise is the horse and most likely cause.

Opticen is basically convenient food. Results has numerous elements that have been used for years without any direct link to Rhabdo.

Now, on Results and Nitrean, I've gotten stronger and my body comp has improved. Should I send Chris a check as a reward for the improvements?

Finally, you're ticked off that all you had was online reviews to judge the product. I feel bad for anyone who uses online reviews as the sole purpose of buying something.

Caveat Emptor.
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