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Old 04-01-2008, 11:53 AM   #11
Steve Reggio
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

I have done three Marathons:
2005 Marine Corp: 3:59 Trained doing a RW Program. Bad ITB issues, real slow recovery.
2006 Chicago: 3:34 (Flat Course) Same RW program, added more weight training. Better but still slow recovery
2007 Marine Corp: 3:49 (hard course) Trained using CrossFit only (for the most part- I did three 10 milers and one 12 miler during the summer) better recovery and my legs felt great. Was back doing a squat heavy WOD on Tuesday. Lack of running did cause my feet some pain but better than training for a marathon.

2008 Marine Corp- Already registered through a charity program, will use CF only and add 1-2 runs of 8-10 miles in Sept/Oct.

If she CF's and does one good track speed work run and adds a little distance later in the program she will be fine.

If she wants to ask questions about it- PM me, happy to help.
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Old 04-02-2008, 10:19 AM   #12
Jeff Sketeris
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

I started Crossfit on a regular basis in April 2007, and I had completed multiple 5K's and 10K's over the past 10 years (recreational runner).

I had completed ONE marathon (LA Marathon) in 1999 at a time of 5hrs, 09 mins & change.

After feeling the successes of Crossfit protocols, I decided to tackle a Marathon again - this time the Las Vegas Marathon in December 2007.

My plan was to get in my long run once per week on the weekends, gradually building from 6 miles to 19 miles at the maximum. The plan started in late August and lasted until late November, when I the did a two-week taper to recover and be fully ready for the event on 12/2/07.

I ran - injury free - in 4hrs 38min 55sec, which blew away my PR and was accomplished nearly a decade later. I also was not nearly as sore or "beat up" as last time. Crossfit really helped me to train my entire body so that my abs, arms, upper back, etc - what one may not ordinarily think of as "running muscles" - helped to keep my form and posture strong throughout the race. I felt strong at mile 24 as much as I did at mile 2.

I trained CF three days a week (MWF) in a Bootcamp-style program courtesy of Eric LeClair here in Monrovia - lots of bodyweight work and running, as well as kettlebells and O-lifts from time to time. I then added the long runs on my own by doing multiple laps around the Rose Bowl here in Pasadena. I would progress by adding mileage to my weekly long runs as follows:

6, 7, 8, 6, 10, 11, 9, 13, 14, 12, 16, 17, 15, 19.

For info, I am not "built" like a runner - I am a meso/endomorph, and my best 10K time is 50:33:00. This worked for me though and if someone wanted to tackle this for the first time, I highly recommend CF as part of the training and wish them all the best of luck and success.
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Old 04-02-2008, 08:02 PM   #13
Grant Scalf
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

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Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
No offense, Grant, but if you actually LOOK AT the RW suggested plan for a beginning marathoner, it does not suggest more than ONE long run per week - not every other day. And it does not recommend a run of greater than 10 miles until the end of the 6th week.

Sure - we are all here for CF, but training for a marathon is a very specific goal... so there does tend to be some sport-specific specialization involved in it.

That said, I would tend to think that for RUNNING a marathon, RW is a trusted source.

Of course - reasonable minds may differ.
Well I wasn't going to take offense to it until I saw the "LOOK AT" yelling at me, and for the fact that I did look at the program. I looked at the beginner's program and saw it had the person running entirely too many miles per week. I also noticed it had one day of cross-training. I have read my fair share of RW and know their idea of XT is biking or swimming. Here is a rather lengthy quote from one of the articles you mentioned on marathon training:

Quote:
For some of our panelists, "supple-mental training"--aerobic cross-training activities like cycling and swimming, and gym work like lifting and core exercises--is an acceptable option only on nonrunning days, as long as the workouts are short (less than an hour) and low-intensity. The idea is to focus your energies on your running days, since those are the workouts that are ultimately going to get you across the marathon finish line. Others require cross-training workouts--two or three a week for Galloway and Pierce. "Cross-training offers most of the advantages of running more miles without the pounding that can lead to fatigue and injury," says Pierce. According to Pierce, doing 30 to 60 minutes of strenuous aerobic activities, such as swimming or biking, allows your running muscles to recharge while you still reap cardiovascular and muscular benefits, helping you become fitter even when you're not running.

There is, however, wide agreement among our experts as to which cross-training activities are best for runners, with swimming, cycling, strength training, walking, yoga, and aqua-running topping the list in roughly that order. "Swimming improves circulation and strengthens the upper body, with no stress on the legs," Paul says. Cycling focuses on the legs, but emphasizes different muscles than running and gets you out on your favorite roads and trails. As for gym workouts, mix low-impact cardio time on an elliptical or stairclimber with upper-body strength training (choose light weights with high reps to boost muscle endurance) and core exercises. "Core work improves stride efficiency, lessens fatigue, and reduces injuries," the Finkes say.
This strikes me as some of the most absurd ideas for cross training I could think of.

Enough of that though. As someone stated previously, Brian MacKenzie had a great article in a recent CFJ on training for endurance events such as a marathon. In it he explains VO2 max and cardiovascular endurance are not the limiting factors in these races. The strength, stamina, and conditioning of the muscles is the limiting factor. Training only in the oxidative energy pathway is a crime, and this is exactly what RW has the person doing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
That said, I would tend to think that for RUNNING a marathon, RW is a trusted source.
I may be out of line here, but thinking a magazine is a trusted source for anything is inherently wrong. They have an agenda and that is to sell more subscriptions. This is like taking weight lifting advice from Muscle and Fitness. It will only get you so far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Dunston View Post
Sure - we are all here for CF, but training for a marathon is a very specific goal... so there does tend to be some sport-specific specialization involved in it.
There is of course some sport-specific specialization involved in training for anything, but only the top tier require any great amount of it. If you would have taken a look at my training log like I had said you would have found I did do some running specific workouts. I did not, however, run 20-40 miles per week gearing up for the half marathon. I did not even run 10 miles a week. Actually, I only logged about 10 miles in the last 4 weeks leading up to the half. Once someone has built their base endurance/VO2 max it changes very little with more cardiovascular stimuli.

Bottom line: If a person was to follow just the CF WOD and add in a long run every week or so to their liking, they will do remarkably well in the marathon. Plenty of people have proven this with their posts here in this thread among many others on the board.
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Old 01-03-2009, 02:07 AM   #14
Matthew Townsend
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

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Originally Posted by Grant Scalf View Post
Bottom line: If a person was to follow just the CF WOD and add in a long run every week or so to their liking, they will do remarkably well in the marathon. Plenty of people have proven this with their posts here in this thread among many others on the board.
You've answered all my questions.

Will follow your suggested strategy in the Melbourne Marathon after making a bet with someone recently that I could do it.

I've done Triathlons before doing only CF and finished in the top 18%. I suspected that I could do the same with a marathon, but wanted a bit of reassurance before taking the plunge.

Once again, Crossfit rocks.
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Old 01-03-2009, 08:29 PM   #15
Christian Groenveld
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

I just ran a marathon in November following crossfit + crossfit endurance with a 3 on 1 off training schedule. I modified the CFE by substituting the long runs they prescribe (usually 13.1 miles or 3 x 5K) w/ a weekend long run based on a marathon program. This worked out remarkably well for me and I think other non-runners like myself who have a decent crossfit base can successfully run a marathon w/ crossfit & CFE. B/C of injury, i had to replace strength workouts with more metcon workouts, but still followed all crossfit workouts.

Personally, I don't think you can get away with only the main page crossfit wod's plus one weekend long run to be prepared for a marathon. Crossfit gets you in great overall shape, but a marathon isn't general fitness. CFE is a great source and you can integrate those workouts w/ the crossfit wod's easily. again, only my opinion, but I think a minimum of 2 CFE wod's/week plus a long run on the weekend will do it. Don't bother w/ the runners world or other running programs if you'd like to keep doing crossfit and keep your mileage down. They are great programs if your focus is running though. With CFE, you're only running on average ~20-30 mins per wod and more fun than just running.
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Old 01-04-2009, 02:13 PM   #16
Justin McGinley
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

Christian,
Did you do the CFE WOD's instead of the regular CF WOD's, or a few hours before/after, like the page suggests?
I personally don't have the time, or ability to run well in the morning before work, so I'd probably only have time for one WOD/day, plus the long weekend run. Do you think that would be enough?

I'm running the Broad Street Run in Philly, which is only 10 miles, so I think i'm good, but I don't know. Leading up to it last year, I ran all the time, always long distances....so I want to be sure I'm utilizing CF and CFE the best way possible, to get me ready for this race!

Last edited by Justin McGinley : 01-04-2009 at 02:15 PM. Reason: DELETE
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Old 01-04-2009, 02:17 PM   #17
Alycia McGinley
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

whoops!
That was me, writing as "Justin McGinley". I didn't realize I was signed in as him.
Anyway, thats my question
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Old 01-04-2009, 03:04 PM   #18
Michael Halbfish
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

I did a combo of FIRST training which someone previously mentioned and Crossfit. It worked real well. I then switched to Crossfit and Crossfitendurance.com workouts (CFE). While I don't know about performance, I am enjoying CFE more than anything that I've previously done.

This new year I will be doing the following Max Mormont's www.maxfitusa.com Crossfit Workouts CFE, and Max's O-lifts. My plan is on day 1 of the Crossfit cycle WOD and CFE. Day 2 WOD and O-WOD (CFE Rest day)
Day 3 Crossfit.
Day 3 may be nothing or it may be O-Lift orCFE (especially if I missed a day) or something else probably yoga or a MonkeyBarGym metcon involving lots of jumping.

Day 4 Crossfit Rest Day Do CFE and yoga or mobility training or rest.

My Crossfit warmups also involve a lot of agility work
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Old 01-04-2009, 03:45 PM   #19
Alycia McGinley
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

Thanks for the advice and sample schedule.
I haven't seen MaxFit USA yet, so I'll start checking it out when deciding which workouts to do.

You are about 20 min north of me in NJ. Do you ever visit an affiliate, or do you just practice at your gym/home? I try to get to CrossFit Tribe in Cherry Hill when I can, but that's a hike for me. There is one in Trenton as well, but I haven't visited there yet.
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Old 01-04-2009, 03:53 PM   #20
Christian Groenveld
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Re: Marathon training & crossfit scheduling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin McGinley View Post
Christian,
Did you do the CFE WOD's instead of the regular CF WOD's, or a few hours before/after, like the page suggests?
I personally don't have the time, or ability to run well in the morning before work, so I'd probably only have time for one WOD/day, plus the long weekend run. Do you think that would be enough?

I'm running the Broad Street Run in Philly, which is only 10 miles, so I think i'm good, but I don't know. Leading up to it last year, I ran all the time, always long distances....so I want to be sure I'm utilizing CF and CFE the best way possible, to get me ready for this race!

Alycia - I did crossfit and crossfit endurance wod's. I usually ended up doing one workout after another, which really sucked. When I was really exhausted, I would do a fast CFE wod like tabata just to do something. I also started working out in the morning or during lunch to do the CF wod then CFE when I got home at night. It was a lot. I think crossfit plus a weekend long run should be enough for 10 miles. Maybe just throw in another day of CFE when you have the time. When I first started training for the marathon, I did a 5 mile run and the most I ran previously was 5k w/ crossfit, and I did well then, so 10 shouldn't be a problem for you. I hear the Broad St. run is a lot of fun...good luck!

Check out my log to see what I did...i trained for about 18 weeks, but had to take 2 weeks off twice b/c of injury. w/f/s...
http://www.board.crossfit.com/showth...128#post466128
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