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Old 08-18-2003, 07:14 PM   #1
Patrick Johnston
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I was wondering if anyone could recommend an effective and very digestable (no cramps or farts) brand and/or form of creatine. Any informed opinions (especially Robb's) would be appreciated. Also, is creatine generally recommended? What are the pros and cons? I don't eat much red meat right now (once a month or so) if that makes any difference. Thanks in advance.
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Old 08-19-2003, 12:05 AM   #2
Robert Wolf
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Patrick-

I really like the company Bioplex, but any pharmaceutical grade product is fine. Shop around as the prices vary incredibly. Bioplex has a plain creatine monohydrate which is good quality and inexpensive...the product with sugar is a waste of money, just go for the plain variety.

Red meat is a good source of creatine, however most fish, poultry etc. will provide ample amounts as well.
Robb
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Old 08-19-2003, 04:15 AM   #3
David Heyer
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Rob knows MUCH more than I do on this subject, but in my opinion you don't need it at all. I'm not much into any supplements. I believe that if you were to have it, it would come in natural food. I also believe that Creatine will cause health problems in the long run if you supplement for long periods of time, or use really high doses.
I work with a young bodybuilder and ex-football player who takes creatine/all other fad supplements. He looks like a stud. But.... not to sound egotistical, he can't keep up with me at any activity.
Forget the supplements, do Crossfit, sleep more and eat right. Your body will reward you!
Dave
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Old 08-19-2003, 09:59 AM   #4
Robert Wolf
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David-

In general I would agree where supplements are concerned however creatine has quite a body of research indicating that it lowers bad cholesterol, raises good cholesterol, decreases the likelyhood of CVA's (stroke) just to list a few benefits. I endorse very few suplements but creatine happenes to be one I do endorse.

It may improve ones athletecism (~ 25% of people using it are non-responders and do not receive significant performance improvement) the health benefits alone are woth the price IMO.
Robb
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Old 08-19-2003, 02:44 PM   #5
David Heyer
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Rob,
I'm a stubborn s.o.b., so bear with me. It would take a whole lot of proof for me to budge on this one. I also believe that in a few years the damage creatine users/abusers cause to their kidneys will be irreversible! I hope that I'm wrong on that.
I was under the impression that your body could only assimulate a minute amount of creatine. Pretty much the amount in an average steak. So why bother purchasing additional creatine when you eat all you can get/absorb?
Isn't it true that most of the research was/is conducted by or paid for by the companies that produce creatine. I think the point would be to sucker the public to purchase their products.
I would think that a placebo effect also may be the cause for some of the "improvements".
Do you know of any good studies on the internet? Let me know.
Thanks,
Dave
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Old 08-19-2003, 04:32 PM   #6
Ahmed Moussa
 
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From all that I have gathered about cretine, its an amazing supplement. However, im also taking into account the fact that a good majority of Crossfitters are following reduced carbohydrate eating patterns. The only people that I have seen benefit from Creatine are junk food eating teenagers who drink sodas all day and beer all night. This seems to support the theory by most reports that the best result in uptake for creatine comes from an insulin response. IMO, insulin response is bad, and i would feel like trash if i evoked an insulin response pre workout as the guidelines for creatine ask for. The Natural Hormonal Enhancement site with Ask ROb has a question on there about eating low carb and taking creatine. IMO, its a cheap supplement which works on more than an aesthetic level, its worth trying on paleo. Good luck.

-Ahmed
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Old 08-20-2003, 07:14 AM   #7
Patrick Johnston
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Thanks for all the input. Please keep it coming. Robb, I would love to see some of these studies if you can direct me to any that you think I might find interesting. Also Robb, please drop me an email to let me know how Chico is. How are you, John, the academy, etc. doing? If it is easier, give me a call. I hope all is well and it is not too hot.
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Old 08-20-2003, 08:15 AM   #8
Jeff Reiser
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Creatine worked for me, but when I quit taking it I lost about 10 lbs. To a man, seeing there body shrink by 10 lbs. was mentally hard. Also, I lost only a little strenght, you know a rep here or there.

Having said that, now I take a multi-vitamin and eat real well, lots of protein, etc., and I am in much better shape now.
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Old 08-20-2003, 10:59 AM   #9
Larry Lindenman
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There is a large body of scientific studies, some long term, which prove the safety of creatine and no reputable studies which show any harmful side effects. That being said, I haven't used it in about two years, but saw good results when I did. All I could say is try it per the recomendations (10 g / day load X 1 wk 5g / maintain) for a month and report back your results. Non-responders have found taking creatine with a sugery drink increases it's effectiveness. I would disagree that you never want a insulin spike, I believe there is research which shows insulin spikes are anabolic, especially post exercise (hence the post workout Protein / carb drink).
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Old 08-20-2003, 12:04 PM   #10
Robert Wolf
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David-

Stuborn is good! John Berardi at www.testosterone.net has sifted through much of the research regarding creatine. Give his site a look. Also putting creatine into the Pubmed search engine will give you reems of good research. I apologize for not having more specifics but I'll have to leave to "proving" up to you! Your questions are good. All I can say is no one is getting rich off of creatine and it truely appears to be safe.

Larry-

Most of the post workout anabolism is actually NOT attributable to insulin but rather to aspects of the neuroendocrine response, specifically the IGF (insulin like growth factor) family. I really like NHE but everything I read about insulin spikes scares me. The post workout window is an environment in which insulin sensitivity is greatly increased. I have been tinkering with moderate carb/protein feedings at this time and making most of my other meals fat protein. I like how I feel and the results I have been achieving. I do not do the carb feeding after every workout...I try to keep some randomness in there. NHE claims a post workout carb feeding will squealch hgH release but this does not appear to be the case.
Robb
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