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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 08-14-2008, 12:39 PM   #21
Kevin McMahon
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

[quote=Zeeshan Parvez;375510] Now since I do not lift weights, the only way i see of getting stronger is isometrics. QUOTE]

You cannot do pushups, pullups, Hand stand pushups, squats, burpies, or walking lunges. The only way you could possibly get stronger sans weights is isometrics? Im highly confused then A) on what you are doing as a workout routine, and B) what your purpose is on crossfit.com if the only thing that is a part of your routine in isometrics.

Like has been discussed in other threads, isometrics has its place. That place is not going to be in most crossfit routines, mainly because the programming of crossfit naturally prevents most people from having plateaus, and we arent generally worried about how much weight we can lift anyway. I agree it helps break plateaus, but that is also if you are doing a typical split routine type weight workout. And yes for things like planches and other gymnastic type skills it probably does help a little, because its already a static move, and training in steps with isometrics is really the only way to train for such maneuvers.
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Old 08-14-2008, 02:03 PM   #22
Blair Robert Lowe
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

Zeehan, if you really wish to train like a gymnast you need to type in gymnasticbodies.com and check out some of Sommer's stuff.

And to end all arguments, gymnasts do not only do isometrics. We do isokinetics/dynamic, and plyometrics. And visualization. We do all them all to get all their benefits together.

If all you want to be is strong in holds, well go for statics then.
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Old 08-14-2008, 03:16 PM   #23
Justin Shipley
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

hard to get what angle the OP is getting at on this thread...i want to respond, yet..
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Old 08-14-2008, 03:57 PM   #24
Kevin McMahon
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

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Originally Posted by Blair Robert Lowe View Post
Zeehan, if you really wish to train like a gymnast you need to type in gymnasticbodies.com and check out some of Sommer's stuff.

And to end all arguments, gymnasts do not only do isometrics. We do isokinetics/dynamic, and plyometrics. And visualization. We do all them all to get all their benefits together.

If all you want to be is strong in holds, well go for statics then.

Im sorry if my post came off as that was the only thing gymnasts do. I know the many things that gymnasts do and i worked at the local gym for a bit last year working with both the guys and girls teams, and really there is very little isometric training involved. I said gymnastic type skills and i meant things like planches and flagpoles and such. i was by no means trying to trivialize gymnastics training down to "do isometrics and you be on the gymnast path."
I have seen what it takes, and even for crossfitters, what competing gymnasts do as daily workouts, is plain insanity.
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Old 08-14-2008, 04:38 PM   #25
Brian Degenaro
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

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Originally Posted by Kevin McMahon View Post
I have seen what it takes, and even for crossfitters, what competing gymnasts do as daily workouts, is plain insanity.
No, no, no, it's not insane. We're insane. There's a big difference.
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There is no substitute for strength, and no excuse for the lack of it.
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Old 08-14-2008, 06:07 PM   #26
Blair Robert Lowe
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

Honestly, not all programs at gyms have really any decent S&C programs. You'll tend to see more progressive ones in MAG, since strength holds are more required. You'll generally only see shaping in WAG besides some dynamic strength skills like lever pulls. It really varies from gym to gym, region to region and where the master coaches come from or trained under.

I wasn't really referring to you, Kevin, but Zeehan.

Brian, if you have ever met Roger, I concur with the insanity part as well as training most of the release moves or running at stationary objects.
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Old 08-14-2008, 07:16 PM   #27
Zeeshan Parvez
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

Well, Kevin the thing is that if I was still doing weights I would defiently given crossfit a chance. The program looks pretty good with a mixture of endurance training and strength training combined with improved flexibility and coordination. But due to certain reasons I cannot wieght train.

Push ups and pull ups won't do it. I know. I have been in the strength training scene long enough to realize that. Hence, I will be utilizing isometrics. How? Over a range of angles ofcourse, so that the strength transfers over to the complete range of motion. I know it works with weights. Now I will just be using immovable objects in place. Then when I can do weight training again, I will probably return to try crossfit.
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Old 08-14-2008, 08:00 PM   #28
Kevin Carpenter
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

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Originally Posted by Zeeshan Parvez View Post
Well, Kevin the thing is that if I was still doing weights I would defiently given crossfit a chance. The program looks pretty good with a mixture of endurance training and strength training combined with improved flexibility and coordination. But due to certain reasons I cannot wieght train.

Push ups and pull ups won't do it. I know. I have been in the strength training scene long enough to realize that. Hence, I will be utilizing isometrics. How? Over a range of angles ofcourse, so that the strength transfers over to the complete range of motion. I know it works with weights. Now I will just be using immovable objects in place. Then when I can do weight training again, I will probably return to try crossfit.
Zeeshan, you've posted on some very interesting topics lately. I must say I'm a bit confused though. Unless you're working in captivity I'm confused as to how you cannot weight train. Are you working in the jungle? Are you severely injured?

Please don't take this the wrong way, but it seems like posting questions on a site where weight lifting is an integral component while looking for ways to develop fitness specifically without weight lifting would be counterproductive and frustrating. You're not doing crossfit? Like I said I enjoy a lot of the topics you bring up, but it would be like going to a fitness website that is nutrition-focused and asking questions on how to develop better fitness but specifically leaving nutrition out.

I'm not trying to be argumentative; just hoping to better understand where you're coming from.
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Old 08-14-2008, 10:27 PM   #29
Kevin McMahon
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

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Originally Posted by Kevin Carpenter View Post
Zeeshan, you've posted on some very interesting topics lately. I must say I'm a bit confused though. Unless you're working in captivity I'm confused as to how you cannot weight train. Are you working in the jungle? Are you severely injured?

Please don't take this the wrong way, but it seems like posting questions on a site where weight lifting is an integral component while looking for ways to develop fitness specifically without weight lifting would be counterproductive and frustrating. You're not doing crossfit? Like I said I enjoy a lot of the topics you bring up, but it would be like going to a fitness website that is nutrition-focused and asking questions on how to develop better fitness but specifically leaving nutrition out.

I'm not trying to be argumentative; just hoping to better understand where you're coming from.
Kind of the same thing that i was thinking. I mean your on this site, yet dont plan on doing anything that it offers, and the only way you think you can possibly gain any strength right now is isometrics? And your such a fitness guru that you know for a fact that pull-ups and push-ups will provide you no gains in strength. Maybe im not being open-minded enough, but your mindset seems a little out there to me.

And to the not wanting, or not being able to use weights, i have seen countless equipment free programs here on crossfit that would kick anyones butt. Then again pushups and pullups dont increase your strength so i guess they would be useless to you and youd be better off pushing against immobile objects like walls..........

As with most things im just going to say to each his own, but i guess to better comment on your seemingly off the wall type workout programs, i would need a better idea of what your trying to accomplish, especially when you are picking the brains of a community that is using a program that is pretty much nothing that you seem to be willing or able to do.
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Old 08-15-2008, 02:18 AM   #30
Zeeshan Parvez
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Re: Isometrics - 15-20% carry over off strength so if you do isometrics at...

That is why this is pretty much the last topic I posted about! You see I came across crossfit because I was searching on how do the planche. There were some very good threads on here about the planche. After reading them, I posted a few of my thoughts about planches and asked for some advice. And since I love talking, I got onto other topics only to realize that this is primarily a crossfit disscussion board and not a general exercise board!
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