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Old 07-07-2008, 02:18 AM   #1
ScottWalker
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Just started

Hi all,

I just started CrossFit and I have done a total of two and a half weeks of training. I am really liking it and the more I learn about it the more I like it. I love the idea and concept behind it all. Anyway I did CFT tonight for the first time and I could of done better, but working out this way has taken its toll on me. I was used to doing a mix between a power lifting routine and a modern body building routine. I pretty much trained everything once a week until now. I think since I started CrossFit I have been doing nothing, but using my legs it seems. Holy cow my legs are toast and I have been barely using weights at all. OK OK, anyway the real question I have is where do I rank with my CFT numbers? First of all I am 190 pounds at 5ft 6in. I did a somewhat conservative numbers on all lifts for I am not sure if my legs were going to give out or not. HEHE!! Anyway I did 375 Squat, 205 Push Press (never done these before) and a 445 Dead. If you all could shed some light on me I would appreciate it.

Oh and one other thing. I have worked hard to gain weight from 135 pounds to my current weight and at times up to 205. So my question is if I do the 3 days on 1 day off cycle will it be hard for me to keep my weight or ever gain weight (muscle weight)?

Thanks,

Scott
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Old 07-07-2008, 03:30 AM   #2
Elliot Fuller
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Re: Just started

Your diet will determine how much of your mass you gain or lose. Many a body-builder have come to CrossFit seeking "overall fitness," aka GPP, and have found that their lifts and body mass have suffered. In my opinion, CrossFit's best feature is that it allows your body to determine how to be efficient on its own.

A 5'6" 190/200# person is not my definition of efficiency. That's not intended as a jab at all. But clearly you are of the bodybuilding mentality, which may or may not suit you as far as CrossFit is concerned. CrossFit isn't for bodybuilding necessarily, but it can be catered to it, depending on your goals and your diet (see Max Effort Black Box, and Performance Menu).

Your CFT is great in those particular areas. However I would personally consider 190 or 200 pounds to be about 20 to 30 pounds overweight for your height. That's just me though, and seriously it just depends on what you want to get out of it.

If you do JUST CrossFit, odds are you will lose some of that extra mass, as your body tries to become more efficient. There's just not enough heavy lifting stimulus, in my opinion, to support that, with just straight-up CrossFit. You could modify it from 3 on 1 off to include some heavy lifting days, or you could do something like what Performance Menu offers.

The bottom line, in my personal and humble opinion, is that you need to decide for yourself what your goals are. If you want to be a bodybuilder, then you need to be bodybuilding, doing heavy lifting, eating right, etc. If you want GPP, then you need to be doing CrossFit, eating right, etc. If you want some of both worlds, you can have that too.

But it's probably unrealistic for you to want the best of bodybuilding, along with the best of GPP.

So be realistic with yourself on what your goals are. Being overweight for your height is generally inefficient, and there's a certain point where added mass becomes less functional and more detrimental, in my opinion. Of course if mass gaining and increased lifts are your goal, then more power to you.

As you're bound to hear over and over again in your stay here: your diet will determine 90% of your composition.
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Old 07-07-2008, 06:04 AM   #3
Jason David
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Re: Just started

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottWalker View Post
Hi all,

I just started CrossFit and I have done a total of two and a half weeks of training. I am really liking it and the more I learn about it the more I like it. I love the idea and concept behind it all. Anyway I did CFT tonight for the first time and I could of done better, but working out this way has taken its toll on me. I was used to doing a mix between a power lifting routine and a modern body building routine. I pretty much trained everything once a week until now. I think since I started CrossFit I have been doing nothing, but using my legs it seems. Holy cow my legs are toast and I have been barely using weights at all. OK OK, anyway the real question I have is where do I rank with my CFT numbers? First of all I am 190 pounds at 5ft 6in. I did a somewhat conservative numbers on all lifts for I am not sure if my legs were going to give out or not. HEHE!! Anyway I did 375 Squat, 205 Push Press (never done these before) and a 445 Dead. If you all could shed some light on me I would appreciate it.

Oh and one other thing. I have worked hard to gain weight from 135 pounds to my current weight and at times up to 205. So my question is if I do the 3 days on 1 day off cycle will it be hard for me to keep my weight or ever gain weight (muscle weight)?

Thanks,

Scott
You mentioned you did Push Pressed 205 -This is different than a Press, Which is what is used in the CFT. Your knees shouldn't bend at all during the movement.

If you did 205 (correctly - a press...not a push press) and you never did a one before...I have to ask. Do you walk around on your hands all day? Instead of your feet?
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Old 07-07-2008, 10:46 PM   #4
ScottWalker
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Re: Just started

Hey thanks for detailed reply Elliot,

If you saw me you probably wouldn't guess that I am the weight I am. Most usually guess that I am 10 to 20 pounds lighter then I am by just looking at me. I guess my point here is that I am pretty heavy at 5ft 6in and I worked hard to get there, but I seem to top out about there or if I eat a whole lot and try real hard I can get up to 205, but it is real hard to keep there. My body just naturally doesn't want to be there. Sorry I am rambling a little here. I feel pretty good at the weight I am and I don't feel that I have slowed down at all and I have always trained all body parts equal, so in other words, I don't have this huge upper body and little legs or vise versa. I think I am pretty proportionate between my upper body and lower. The funny thing is that I never really get big and bulky, but I guess you could say, more or less more dense. Finally to get to the point of my rambling, my extra mass doesn't seem to get in my way or slow me down at all and in fact I seem to be faster and stronger with it. This of course will all remain to be proven as I get a little deeper into the CrossFit world.

Although I can completely understand your point of being to heavy and not an optimal weight for my height. I have always been some what stocky so its in my nature to be a little heavier then most at my height. I have always been lean and if I let my body go with out trying to force it to keep the weight or gain then I lose weight and lean out a little more then I am now to about 180. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind being leaner at all. I guess its just that I for so long always tried to gain weight and it has been a long hard road, so to see it all go would suck. I have been hovering around 190 for about the last 6 years now and it seems to have stuck.

To answer your question on goals, my goals are/would be, to have the best of both worlds if at all possible. I am sure I will have to make a sacrifice some where I just hope for it not to be to drastic. I have been contemplating since the beginning of my CrossFit training how I was going to mix the two to get the best of both worlds. Right now I am on kind of a crash course to see where it takes me and so far I like the results. To my surprise I have not lost any weight, but maintained and I seem to have tightened up a little since starting CrossFit. Also after doing the CFT last night and considering the state in which I did it (slight bit worn out from CrossFit). It seems that I may be able to maintain my strength.

Fingers and eyes crossed that I can. HEHEHE!! The goal for me in doing CrossFit is to of course get in better condition. I travel %100 for work so I am not able to get the same type of training schedule I used to when I worked at home. I used to sparr/train 5 to 6 times a week and then do heavy lifting. Lots of sparring rounds and heavy Squats, Benches, Barbell Rows and Deads kepted me in good condition. Lately after 3 years of doing the traveling and getting to sparr if I am luckly 1 or 2 times a month doesn't keep me in as good as shape as I was. I started to notice my level of conditioning start to drop when I would come home to sparr. In short I was sucking wind. CrossFit is looking up to be my savior in that department. I never did any running because I seemed to just get weaker and lose weight doing it, so I was just sucking it up and settling for being out of breath when I would get to sparr while I was home.

Well as you might have guess I am tired of being out of breath and want to be back to where I was and much better. I wouldn't mind being a little lighter at around 180, but not much less and especially if I can maintain or even better gain strength and power. I have been thinking of doing exactly what you suggested of throwing a couple of heavy lifting sessions in here and there. I guess now all I have to do is go through the trial and error figuring out what is going to be optimal for me. Thank again for your feed back I really appreciate it.


Jason,

Is 205 really that good of a lift? I have pushed up for a good strict 7 to 8 reps of 265 of seated military press. I might have pushed with my legs a little, but not a lot and like I said I didn't go all out for it is a new lift for me and I don't feel the greatest of control over the lift as of yet.


Thanks,

Scott
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Old 07-08-2008, 12:52 AM   #5
Elliot Fuller
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Re: Just started

Sorry if my post came off as negative. There are lots of guys on here who weigh more than they "should" optimally, who still wreck the WODs. So I didn't mean to imply that if you're overweight (in a bodybuilding sense) that you can't excel at the WODs.

There are also lots of lighter folks on here who wreck the WODs. Look no further than Chris Spealler, who hit a 2:05 Fran at like 135# bodyweight.

All I really wanted to suggest was that typically the world of bodybuilding, in the strict sense of things, is separate from the world of fitness. Trial and error is pretty much what you've gotta do, and you're already going in that direction.

My advice would be to get on a solid diet to maintain what you've got right now, and just do the WODs for a little while. If you start losing more than you want to, or you notice strength decreases, then maybe start subbing in some heavy lifts.

Anyways, just wanted to clear up my previous post. For many people the extra weight helps; for many others it slows them down. I've been up to 165# and ended up dropping back to 150# just because "my body told me so." I've found plenty of room for growth at this weight, and it's worked fine for me so far. So just find what works for you according to your goals.

But to be realistic, it's probably pretty rare for strongman competitors to have the same kind of metcon that athletes like Chris Spealler have.
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Old 07-08-2008, 05:58 AM   #6
Jason David
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Re: Just started

Scott,
If you're doing the movement properly...205 at your bodyweight is borderline "elite".

Do it right...and never do anything sitting down that you can do standing up.

Also do a search on the data you are looking for in the forum. It's there...Try searching "Basic Strength Standards"
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Old 07-08-2008, 10:40 PM   #7
ScottWalker
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Re: Just started

Hey Elliot,

Sorry if I implied that I was offended from your post. I am most certainly not offended in anyway. I was just trying to discuss the topic a little further and I appreciate what you have given me, especially the hint to Black Box stuff. Thanks again.

Jason,

Thanks for the tip. Cool I am border line Elite and just think I am just starting.......Hmm give me a few more weeks and I will be superman. HAHAHA!! Yes I know I am a dork, but I guess someone has to be one. Thanks for the comments dude.

Scott
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