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Old 08-17-2005, 10:10 PM   #11
Skip Chase
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Ok, but I think we are getting way too deep into the evolution thing. Today, we are eating because of the way we were conditioned. The items that are in your fridge and pantry are not there because you are preparing for the winter solstice. The cave man had to deal with the stuff that was growing when it was growing. We can get our fruit whenever we put it in the cart. Cave dude did not have the benefit of a fruit rollup or sugar smacks!:happy:
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Old 08-18-2005, 05:30 AM   #12
Scott Kustes
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But Skip, conditioning is easy when it's in your genes. While cavemen had to deal with finding what was there and that evolutionary mechanism would have greatly helped, that same mechanism is a hindrance to us. And food/chemical additive companies are aware of how our sugar mechanism works.

We're speaking the same language brother...just looking at it from opposite sides.
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Old 08-18-2005, 08:46 AM   #13
Kevin Czarnecki
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Hi Skip, I see where you coming from about todays enviroment...but just because a caveman did not have access to sugar, doesn't mean it still didn't taste good. If a brownie falls in the woods and no one is around to eat it, is it not sweet?:wink:

I was thinking more in the lines of the science behind why we percieve taste the way that we do. To people, food my not taste anything like it really taste like. We only percieve it to taste good based on how our genes want use to percieve it. If you could find a creature that does not need carbs to survive, sugar may taste like a steaming pile of sh*t.:-)

It's all about what is driving our perceptions, wether it be genetics or conditioning. You are correct about condiontioning as well, just like Scott said, it's easy to condition something if you exploit its basic genetic drive. My dog will do anything for a hotdog...

Good discussion!:happy:

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Old 08-18-2005, 12:39 PM   #14
Skip Chase
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We are all on the same page. However, it is my belief that "genetics are a tendency, not a destiny". If genetics were a destiny, I would be be overweight or obese, lazy and suffer from diabetes. Instead, I am 53, 8% body fat and do sit-ups for 24 hours. I don't think the cave dude stood under the tree and ate all the apples. I have had clients who said, 'Its genetic that I'm fat. My parents are fat, my brothers and sisters are fat...we have the fat gene'. I look in the families fridge and pantry and they are filled with 'fat pills'. We battle food manufactures that figured out we are addicted to sugar and they sprinkle it on everything, and deceive us with labeling. I hold a container of yogurt. Today, it is the #1 afternoon and mid-morning snack for a woman in a sedentary job. The label says 'Fat free'. It even says on the side of the label, "The only yogurt clinically shown to help you BURN MORE FAT than just cutting calories alone." How the heck does it do that, especially with these 40 grams of sugar!!! Nationwide, we are picking up these little containers. I put on seminars, and discuss food labeling and sugar addiction. When I discuss food labeling, I always ask this question. We have seen the label, 2% milk. If one cup of whole milk has 81 calories from fat, how many calories from fat are in one cup of 2% milk? (I am sure you know, but, without looking at the label of milk, how many?) The #1 answer is 2% of the 81 calories or 1.62calories. I have yet to have 1 person tell me the correct answer. I then ask, where does the 2% come from?
Sorry for the long post....
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:10 PM   #15
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My point....Scott, you said, "that same mechanism is a hindrance to us"..Kevin, you said, "We only perceive it to taste good based on how our genes want us to perceive it." When you have determined that it is BAD, it now becomes a mental control issue...is the craving controling you or are you strong enough to control the craving. I got angry at myself in 2000 that I was allowing the craving for sugar to control me. I changed. My self talk would say, "Oh, only one won't hurt!" If I had one, that was it..I ate more, more!! I changed the self talk..it wasn't genetic. I'm in charge and responsible for me...
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:17 PM   #16
Scott Kustes
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Ahh yes, you control the craving, but is it still not there? An alcoholic can control his alcohol cravings, but is forever an alcoholic. One drink could be the proverbial straw on the camel's back again. I think everyone of us has those days when the cookies walk by at work and it's hard not to grab one...and another...and another. Controlling a craving doesn't diminish it's genetic component. You prove the point that genetics are a tendency, not a destiny by controlling the "destiny" of our genes to make us enjoy sugar.

As a correlary, I wasn't raised on sugar. I was raised on a pretty healthy diet in comparison to most people. It was largely fat free, but also largely sugar free. I got a Coke or two when we went out to dinner, but other than that, they were never in the house. No junk food except for ice cream, pudding or jello on occasion. I still love sugar. It's hard for me to pass up, but I have been developing that willpower over the past year or so. So my nurture was to not be a sugarholic, but my nature is to be.
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:50 PM   #17
Jason Berger
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My sister came to visit me from accross the country (she left at 3:30am this morning - egad! Airport security thought I was acting sketchy, but I was just trying to stay awake!) and, consequently, for the past week I've been eating pretty badly.

Normally I eat a strict paleo diet and the result has been that modern foods simply don't look like food to me. I have no sugar cravings because all of a sudden my reality has shifted and modern foods are only slightly more nutritious for me than kindling or a sock. Zero sugar cravings, new reality.

And the entire last week that I was eating poorly and feeling crappy as a result, I was thinking, "Oh boy, the first thing I'm going to do when she leaves is eat healthy and work out."

Maybe I'm lucky, but my body just totally craves healthful choices now. It's not like I'm struggling against something within myself.
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:51 PM   #18
Jason Berger
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P.S. And don't get me started on what my body does when I eat modern foods. Talk about flatulence! It's like something crawled into my *** and died....
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Old 08-18-2005, 02:47 PM   #19
Skip Chase
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Jason, you are blessed! You are one of the very few who are not addicted to sugar!! Good for you! I am still wondering if anyone knows the answer to the milk question.:crazy:
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Old 08-18-2005, 03:07 PM   #20
Chris Forbis
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Isn't whole milk 3% fat? So 2% has 2/3 as much fat?
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