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Old 04-05-2013, 11:18 AM   #1
Adam Fullerton
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Smile CrossFit at night

Hi All,

New to the CrossFit community and I really only have two questions left in terms of the Zone Diet.

I plan on warming up and doing the WOD around 8:30/9 PM. If that is the case, and I follow the 7AM, 12PM, 5PM snack, 7:30 PM, and 9:30 PM snack, schedule, would it be wise to adjust my eating schedule at all? I understand eating dinner at 7:30 would provide plenty of energy for my exercise that will be at 8:30/9 PM, but is there enough nutrition AFTER I do the WOD?

Also, with that, if I take a PWO protein shake and eat some fruit, should I just consider that my pre-bed snack? Or should I take a PWO shake w/ fruit AND then another pre-bed snack?

Thanks for your help!

Edit: I plan on eating 16 blocks, as a small male, fyi

- Adam

Last edited by Adam Fullerton : 04-05-2013 at 11:21 AM. Reason: # of blocks
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Old 04-05-2013, 02:33 PM   #2
John Holcombe
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Re: CrossFit at night

I'm not familiar with the blocks but as long as you get your calories/protein for the day you don't need to eat a huge meal after working out. I would personally get at least some carbs and protein after though. Could be in the form of a protein shake.
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Old 04-05-2013, 02:43 PM   #3
Marcus Allen
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Re: CrossFit at night

Adam- first off, unless you are truly tiny, 16 blocks will probably be too little to support regular CFing. It is common for new folks to CF and The Zone to undereat fairly significantly.

Second- have you followed this schedule before now? I am curious as to if you can get to sleep within a couple of hours of an intense workout, so it may be easy enough to just slide the schedule back a couple of hours.

Then, as long as your caloric demands are being met, you should be fine with a combo post wod, pre bed snack.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:40 PM   #4
Adam Fullerton
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Re: CrossFit at night

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Originally Posted by John Holcombe View Post
I'm not familiar with the blocks but as long as you get your calories/protein for the day you don't need to eat a huge meal after working out. I would personally get at least some carbs and protein after though. Could be in the form of a protein shake.
That's what I thought, just wanted to make sure. I would assume that as long as I have something after (like my pre-bed snack), that it will suffice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Allen View Post
Adam- first off, unless you are truly tiny, 16 blocks will probably be too little to support regular CFing. It is common for new folks to CF and The Zone to undereat fairly significantly.

Second- have you followed this schedule before now? I am curious as to if you can get to sleep within a couple of hours of an intense workout, so it may be easy enough to just slide the schedule back a couple of hours.

Then, as long as your caloric demands are being met, you should be fine with a combo post wod, pre bed snack.
I haven't done this exact plan yet, nope. But I play soccer (well, not yet as the season hasn't started) sometimes at 9:00 PM for an hour, then come home, snack, and pass right out. I basically pass out whenever I want to for bed. Sometimes it's a luxury.

I guess my main concern then is to determine my correct # of blocks in order to reach 12% BF. Currently, I weigh 162# and have 20% BF. Calculated that through and it produced 14/15 blocks on Dr. Sear's site. Looking at CFJ 21, it says "small male" is 16. So that's where my final confusion comes in: 14/15 calculated from Sear's, 16 from CFJ 21, and then you are saying 16 would be too minimal?

I would've thought that to start the BF% decrease, 14 would be the start, then once I get to the BF% I want, to then start increasing my blocks until I get to the weight I want, then to start cutting back on carbs and increasing fat.

Am I thinking about this in the wrong way?

Thanks for your guys' help.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:53 PM   #5
Marcus Allen
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Re: CrossFit at night

The problem seems to be that the Zone does not account well for significant exercise. If you do some casual, 20min/day treadmill kind of stuff, the calculations hold well. As soon as you ramp up the intensity however, the wheels seem to come off.

Just, curious, why is your goal 12%? How old are you? Are you doing straight Zone, or the sub fat for carbs version?

Obviously you will need to test this on yourself, and if you are younger, it may be a little difficult to tell whether the changes are from diet or not due to your ability to recover. If you notice any deterioration in sleep, alertness or performance, up the blocks/calories.

Just to give you an idea of 16 blocks is...

Quote:
Okay, 112g of protein works out to exactly 16 protein zone blocks. Here are the relationships between the proteins, carbs and fats to zone blocks.
◾7 grams of protein = 1 zone block
◾9 grams of carbohydrates = 1 zone block
◾1.5 grams of fat = 1 zone block

The Zone recommends a ratio of 1:1:1 for protein, carbs and fat. I will need to spread 112g of protein, 114 grams of carbs and 24 grams of fat throughout the day into 3 meals and 2 snacks. One alarming thing is that if you add up the calories it seems very low:

(112 * 4) + (144 * 4) + (24 * 9) = 448+576+216=1240 cals

I got the calorie calculations from: http://www.nutristrategy.com/nutrition/calories.htm. wfs For the sake of accuracy there are a few other sites that confirm that 4 calories = 1g of protein, 4 calories = 1g of carbs and 9 calories = 1g of fat.
This is why it is so beneficial to CFers to cut the carb blocks in half and double or even triple the fat, it ramps up the calories.
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Last edited by Marcus Allen : 04-05-2013 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:12 PM   #6
Adam Fullerton
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Re: CrossFit at night

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Allen View Post
The problem seems to be that the Zone does not account well for significant exercise. If you do some casual, 20min/day treadmill kind of stuff, the calculations hold well. As soon as you ramp up the intensity however, the wheels seem to come off.

Just, curious, why is your goal 12%? How old are you? Are you doing straight Zone, or the sub fat for carbs version?

Obviously you will need to test this on yourself, and if you are younger, it may be a little difficult to tell whether the changes are from diet or not due to your ability to recover. If you notice any deterioration in sleep, alertness or performance, up the blocks/calories.

Just to give you an idea of 16 blocks is...



This is why it is so beneficial to CFers to cut the carb blocks in half and double or even triple the fat, it ramps up the calories.
Well, that was my main concern, the number of blocks/calories. My goal of 12% was just a goal I saw as being healthy and in "fit" shape. I suppose if I do the WOD 5x a week, I'd need far more calories in order to sustain this level of activity. That is why I was trying to determine why or IF 14 or 16 blocks was even enough. I guess my question now would be: what do you suggest I start at? I've read some people say you should increase your fat blocks dramatically once you reach your target BF% and cut carbs and begin replacing with fat blocks to sustain the energy level. But then to increase oerall blocks by 1-2 as you begin to pit on lean muscle mass. Would you recommend to cut the carbs and in fat sooner than later then?

Just a little confused as what amount of blocks I shoul start at and if it should be 1:1:1 right off the bat. Or start with a cutting of carbs and increase with fat or even do a 1:1:2 ratio.

Thoughts?

Last edited by Adam Fullerton : 04-05-2013 at 06:20 PM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:36 PM   #7
Marcus Allen
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Re: CrossFit at night

What we usually suggest is...
1g protein/lb lean mass
all the veggies you want
3-5 servings of fruit(we don't really follow the fruit fear for weight loss)

if you are unaffected by wheat, add 1-2 servings
if you are unaffected by dairy add 1-2 servings based on your preference and tolerance.

make up calories with healthy fats

it can be this easy. if you want or need more specific guidelines you can get as detailed as you want.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:06 PM   #8
Adam Fullerton
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Re: CrossFit at night

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Allen View Post
What we usually suggest is...
1g protein/lb lean mass
all the veggies you want
3-5 servings of fruit(we don't really follow the fruit fear for weight loss)

if you are unaffected by wheat, add 1-2 servings
if you are unaffected by dairy add 1-2 servings based on your preference and tolerance.

make up calories with healthy fats

it can be this easy. if you want or need more specific guidelines you can get as detailed as you want.
Well that simplified it quite a bit. My last question would be: how many calories total should I shoot for? I would imagine that I up the veggies and fruit (carbs) and especially fat to get to the calories I need. Of course, I will find these out over time, but should I target 1800 calories, for example? And go from there in terms of fat (and a perhaps a few more carbs)?

Thanks again.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:13 PM   #9
Jeff Enge
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Re: CrossFit at night

Im curious, you say you weigh 162#, how tall are you?
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:17 PM   #10
Marcus Allen
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Re: CrossFit at night

Adam- 1800 is probably a good place to start. You can adjust after a couple of weeks of seeing how you feel.

Keep an eye on sleep, focus and performance. If any of these falter, add calories.

Also, if you are relatively untrained in the strength department, you may add weight by increasing lean muscle mass. Focus on performance, appearance will follow.
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