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Exercises Movements, technique & proper execution

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Old 03-06-2006, 03:10 AM   #1
Lee Lister
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I’m interested in if anyone is using Kettlebells as a substitute to bar/weights in Olympic lifts and the results?
Lee
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Old 03-07-2006, 04:34 PM   #2
Michael Stehle
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I use them exclusively. I feel they provide more ROM through out the movement. I also feel they work my grip and shoulder stablizers as well. It could also be that I'm just used to using them. Did all OL's with a bar in college, just seem to enjoy them more with kb's now. JMO
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:20 PM   #3
Garrett Smith
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I sub KBs for my wife's OL in the WODs, as she has wrist problems from past gymnastics injuries and cannot rack the bar.

After having finally done more OL and learning from this board, there is absolutely a place for both in a well-rounded training regimen.
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Old 03-08-2006, 03:38 PM   #4
Larry Lindenman
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Uh...Coach has some thoughts about this, the jist of it is, I'll be a little PC here, KB and O-lifts use diffrent body mechanics. O-lifts give you the benifit of using greater weight. KBs are great, but are not a good substitute for O-lifts. If you have a O-bar and weights, why not use them? If your stuck in a forest, with only a KB, you might want to use a log for the O-lifts and use the KB for the KB lifts.
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Old 03-08-2006, 04:18 PM   #5
Don Stevenson
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I love my kettlebells and think they are a great fitness tool but in my experience they are very different to O lifting and the carryover is minimal.

If you don't have access to bumpers and platforms and coaching then KBs are an acceptable way to develop power but don't expect that you'll go from snatching a 32kg KB to snatching 60kg on a barbell.
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Old 03-08-2006, 07:33 PM   #6
Tom Corrigan
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Larry,
how many times have you clean and jerked a pair of 72# KBs? How many times have you snatched a pair of 72# kbs? How about a pair of 88# KBs?

Do you (or any other CFer who doesn't do OLY style lifts with KBs)have the experience to say that KBs aren't a good substitute for Olympic lifting. Does that mean if I double snatch and C&J KBs, I won't be able to do a fraction of that amount with a bar?? I know from personal experience, that is FAR from the truth.

Obviously, to get max power, you need max weights, but most CF w/os use 135# or less for doing reps with the Oly lifts.

I had no problem jerking 100kg on a bar, the first time I tried it, due to doing multiple sets of jerks with a pair of 72 and 88# KBs.

Why don't you grab some heavy KBs and give it a go? Then your opinion would carry some weight.
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Old 03-08-2006, 07:41 PM   #7
Tom Corrigan
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Don,

I DID go from snatching 32kg KBs to snatching 70kg on a bar. Micheal Street took this pic at CFNorth.

This was about the third time I'd ever snatched with more than a bar, and the first time with 70kg.

Tomhttp://www.crossfit.com/discus/messages/22/21208.jpg
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Old 03-08-2006, 08:14 PM   #8
Josh Everett
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Tom I have snatched & jerked heavy wts w/kb's. It's a differen't animal than the o-lifts done w/the bar. These 2 forms of olympic lifts compliment each other beautifully. In my opinion your missing out if you don't learn & practice both. Also just because someone has never snatched or cleaned a heavy kb doesn't mean their opinion shouldn't be respected. Coach Burgener has never Cleaned and jerked 215k but you can bet your life that his son Casey listens to his coaching.
with all that said if you do not have access to a bar & bumps or do not know how to perform the lifts KB's are an adaquate substitute until you do get a chance to include the classical o-lifts.
anybody know how to spell check on this thing. I'm embarrassed by how dependant I am on that!
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Old 03-08-2006, 08:55 PM   #9
Catherine Imes
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I practice on occasion dead hang snatches with KBs, double kb snatches clean and jerks, alternating snatches. There is minimal swing involved with these.

There is no doubt that they are different lifts. I liken the KB lifts(Snatches, cleans, ect) more to power cleans and snatches. It is hard to do squat cleans and such with KBs(well, at least for me)

But, I attended an Oly workshop this weekend and caught on very quickly to the split jerk, and snatch. I think the 2nd knee dip on the KB jerks (w 2/32kg) and dip under with heavy dbl snatches aided me in learning the movement more easily...and let's face it doing relatively heavy double kb work gives one confidence needed to do things like snatches and split jerks. Well, at least it does me.

All that being said, I did recently acquire bumpers and will start working the Oly lifts while continuing to do the kb work.

I'm in agreement with Michael, stabilizing 2/32s overhead in a jerk was far more challenging than stabilizing a 140lb barbell jerk overhead.

Just my 2 cents.

CI

(Message edited by cimes on March 08, 2006)
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:04 PM   #10
Tom Corrigan
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Josh,
I didn't say disrespected, I said if they had (or had experience training it that way) done it, their opinion would "carry some weight". I can have an opinion about a lot of things, but they don't carry the weight of others that have "been there, done that."

My contention is that KBs (and DBs for that matter) CAN be good substitute for Olympic lifting. Look at what Coach Rut did with his football team that he trained with only DBs. They had some power. Now they would have been MORE powerful with Oly, but it was a GOOD substitution. Again, not better than, but pretty damn good.

Also, even if one didn't have first hand experience, their opinion would have weight if they had seen a group of athletes train with, then w/o Oly lifting, and saw how they performed. Has a group of CFers stopped using barbell OLY lifts for a few months, and substituted heavy KB equivilents into their workouts of the day? Please tell me when this ever happened and what the results were. If it never happened, then it's just speculation and conjecture. In that case, I'm going to listen to people who have done it for themselves. There IS a lot of carry-over from KBs to OLY, if you lift KBs in an explosive manner, heavy weights and low reps. I have cleaned 88#s for reps, which helped me just load up the bar and clean 197# the first time I even cleaned over 135#. I just started adding weight. That's carry-over, and that tells me that cleaning heavy KBs CAN give you most of the benefits of cleaning with a bar.
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