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Old 12-30-2009, 09:05 PM   #1
Trevor Probandt
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Games in 2012, need programming help

Hello Everyone,

My name is Trevor Probandt and I have finally set my training goal for the next couple years as a participant out of Texas in the 2012 games. I have been an athlete and serious powerlifter my whole life, turned 27 in November. I have most recently been training for raw powerlifting meets with bests of 505, 345, and 575 at 6'1" and 208lbs (as you see, not built like a powerlifter.) Now I am tired of box squats, bands, and not being conditioned. So....I set my sights for 2012 and becoming the fittest person I can be and make sure I am not only around for a long damn time for my newborn son, but that I can do whatever he wants, whenever he wants growing up.

I have a powerlifting garage gym and will be adding rings, rower, etc in time. I will be starting Paleo tomorrow and doing 30 straight days. Will also be following the main page WOD, with modifications if need be for skill training. While doing more running while paying attention to technique.

Does this sound like a smart approach? However, I DO NOT want to lose too much max strength. Do you think I would be a good candidate for CFSB?

Thanks for any and all information,
Trevor
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Old 12-30-2009, 11:51 PM   #2
Marcus Allen
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

My .02...

You probably will be an ideal candidate for CFSB. Give CF a try for 30 days, by itself. Use the BrandX scaling so you can get a feel for your recovery.

If all goes well, add some heavy DL, BS, and SP days for another month or so, then go after the CFSB protocol and I bet we'll be seeing you in 2012.

Have Fun!
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Old 12-31-2009, 02:09 AM   #3
Drew Cloutier
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Who says you can't be a conditionned powerlifter??

You're 6'1 and only compete in either the 198lbs or 220lbs, you honestly can't say you've tried to get conditionned while training powerlifting...because if you would have tried, you'd see that its doable (provided you're not a SHW)

If you love powerlifting I don't know why you'd ditch it so easily, and make it out to be useless, and that you'll die because you aren't fit. You're actually enforcing that stereotype of powerlifters being fat and out of shap in your approach.

If you are simply tired of powerlifting that's another story, but don't go say i'm a powerlifter therefore i can't be conditioned.
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Old 12-31-2009, 07:54 AM   #4
Stephen Lipa
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

I have to agree with to large extent to what Drew said: You can be conditioned and still be a powerlifter. About 3 years ago, I was at the height of my powerlifting. I had a 400lb bench press, 500lb deadlift, and 375lb back squat (low due to a recent injury). I am 5'9" and I was about 220lbs at that time. I wasn't the best, but I was training for a small powerlifting competition, which I did fairly well in. At the same time I was training for this, I was also training for a week-long excursion to the Great Smoky Mountain Nation Park. While at the park, I was going to be hiking, primarily up mountains. I did a lot of running and every chance I could get I threw my pack on and did local hikes in my area. While on the trip, I was able to hike up all of the trails, many of them pretty steep and I was able to do the largest(highest) trail in the park. This had an approximate 3500' elevation gain and was a 11 mile round trip hike, if I recall. So it definitely can be done.

However, when it came to hiking (aka endurance), I was dead last up and down the mountains and trails. I had back issues all of the way up each trail and my knees got killed on the way down. Plus, I was carrying 220lbs up those trails which, just being honest, is not the ideal hiking weight, especially when I am only 5'9".

Since training CrossFit, I took a trip this past summer to the great states of Oregon and Washington. I did two very much more demanding summits there(Mt. St. Helens and the South Sister). However, this time, I trained CrossFit and barely did any hiking with the pack on for training. With only training CrossFit, I did two higher, steeper, and more technical hikes than last time. I hadn't done anything major in regards to hiking in 3 years. This time, I had no back pain and my knees held up a lot better. I moved a lot better and faster up these peaks. The point here is that I was not just powerlifting and then doing an entire regiment of endurance exercises. Instead, I was training CrossFit which we know combines elements of powerlifting and endurance as well as other elements.
Based on my own person experiences, I would say that you can definitely get conditioned while still being a powerlifter. However, if you goal is to be in the 2012 CrossFit Games, well then I would say that you would have to train specifically for that as it is going to contain many more elements. Just watching the videos from this years games leads me to believe that anybody who gets to that level has to has to well rounded with fitness and to be exceptional in many areas. I would think that the only way to do that is train specifically for it. My guess would be to do the WODs at first and eventually work up to training that would be well above and beyond what the regular WODs offer. Oh, and I don't think that you will lose on much your max strength because CrossFit does have strength training built into it.
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Old 12-31-2009, 07:59 AM   #5
Trevor Probandt
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Cloutier View Post
Who says you can't be a conditionned powerlifter??

You're 6'1 and only compete in either the 198lbs or 220lbs, you honestly can't say you've tried to get conditionned while training powerlifting...because if you would have tried, you'd see that its doable (provided you're not a SHW)

If you love powerlifting I don't know why you'd ditch it so easily, and make it out to be useless, and that you'll die because you aren't fit. You're actually enforcing that stereotype of powerlifters being fat and out of shap in your approach.

If you are simply tired of powerlifting that's another story, but don't go say i'm a powerlifter therefore i can't be conditioned.
Ok Drew, I am not in the deconditioned state you are thinking of, I'm still only 12% bf, still run a 4.6-4.7 any day of the week, and beat you or just about anyone's *** pushing a prowler or running a quarter. Jeez, I have trained Westside for 8 years, read all I can about conjugate training and the old Russian texts from Siff and even trained many would be powerlifters and more importantly some serious football athletes. I know enough to know I don't know about training and NO, Crossfit is not the be all end all.

I'm not bashing one type of training over the other. However, I am "choosing" to put powerlifting on the back burner, yes I understand that all strength is based upon max effort strength, and pursue other ventures my friend. Life is too short to spend the time hammering myself with food to reach the 275-308 class to play with the big boys of the sport at my height. To reach Worlds or Nationals at the highest level I would need to work in multiply gear and find a monolift to train with. While this may be appealing to many, and I'm glad it is, there is no way I'm going to sacrifice my already semi screwed joints in the pursuit of "GFH" as we call it. My goals are mine and nobody else's and your's are too, which is great. I know you don't have to be a fat *** to get strong, I'm just tired of watching fat asses get into really tight gear, put a mouth piece in, scream and dump one. Makes for a long day in a small space. That being said I think if it is your deal, chalk up, get in the sauna, and go for it. Just not my cup of tea.

Sorry, got long. Guess I will just get my *** in gear and learn as I go. Thanks
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Old 12-31-2009, 08:03 AM   #6
Trevor Probandt
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Spot on Stephen, I agree totally! Just a change in priorities. Not bad mouthing any kind of training, there is no "best program" just what is best for you. Good luck with the back injury.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Lipa View Post
I have to agree with to large extent to what Drew said: You can be conditioned and still be a powerlifter. About 3 years ago, I was at the height of my powerlifting. I had a 400lb bench press, 500lb deadlift, and 375lb back squat (low due to a recent injury). I am 5'9" and I was about 220lbs at that time. I wasn't the best, but I was training for a small powerlifting competition, which I did fairly well in. At the same time I was training for this, I was also training for a week-long excursion to the Great Smoky Mountain Nation Park. While at the park, I was going to be hiking, primarily up mountains. I did a lot of running and every chance I could get I threw my pack on and did local hikes in my area. While on the trip, I was able to hike up all of the trails, many of them pretty steep and I was able to do the largest(highest) trail in the park. This had an approximate 3500' elevation gain and was a 11 mile round trip hike, if I recall. So it definitely can be done.

However, when it came to hiking (aka endurance), I was dead last up and down the mountains and trails. I had back issues all of the way up each trail and my knees got killed on the way down. Plus, I was carrying 220lbs up those trails which, just being honest, is not the ideal hiking weight, especially when I am only 5'9".

Since training CrossFit, I took a trip this past summer to the great states of Oregon and Washington. I did two very much more demanding summits there(Mt. St. Helens and the South Sister). However, this time, I trained CrossFit and barely did any hiking with the pack on for training. With only training CrossFit, I did two higher, steeper, and more technical hikes than last time. I hadn't done anything major in regards to hiking in 3 years. This time, I had no back pain and my knees held up a lot better. I moved a lot better and faster up these peaks. The point here is that I was not just powerlifting and then doing an entire regiment of endurance exercises. Instead, I was training CrossFit which we know combines elements of powerlifting and endurance as well as other elements.
Based on my own person experiences, I would say that you can definitely get conditioned while still being a powerlifter. However, if you goal is to be in the 2012 CrossFit Games, well then I would say that you would have to train specifically for that as it is going to contain many more elements. Just watching the videos from this years games leads me to believe that anybody who gets to that level has to has to well rounded with fitness and to be exceptional in many areas. I would think that the only way to do that is train specifically for it. My guess would be to do the WODs at first and eventually work up to training that would be well above and beyond what the regular WODs offer. Oh, and I don't think that you will lose on much your max strength because CrossFit does have strength training built into it.
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Old 12-31-2009, 10:21 AM   #7
Jay Ashman
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Allen View Post
My .02...

You probably will be an ideal candidate for CFSB. Give CF a try for 30 days, by itself. Use the BrandX scaling so you can get a feel for your recovery.

If all goes well, add some heavy DL, BS, and SP days for another month or so, then go after the CFSB protocol and I bet we'll be seeing you in 2012.

Have Fun!
on the contrary, I don't think CFSB is for him.... look into MEBB or doing 5/3/1 with metcon. CFSB isn't the best program for an advanced lifter, and judging by his lifts, he is that.
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Old 01-01-2010, 05:22 AM   #8
Drew Cloutier
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor Probandt View Post
Ok Drew, I am not in the deconditioned state you are thinking of, I'm still only 12% bf, still run a 4.6-4.7 any day of the week, and beat you or just about anyone's *** pushing a prowler or running a quarter. Jeez, I have trained Westside for 8 years, read all I can about conjugate training and the old Russian texts from Siff and even trained many would be powerlifters and more importantly some serious football athletes. I know enough to know I don't know about training and NO, Crossfit is not the be all end all.

I wasn't getting into a ****ing match with you, so you don't need to throw out all your credentials. Read YOUR OWN WORDS.

you say:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor Probandt View Post
Hello Everyone,

Now I am tired of box squats, bands, and not being conditioned. So....I set my sights for 2012 and becoming the fittest person I can be and make sure I am not only around for a long damn time for my newborn son, but that I can do whatever he wants, whenever he wants growing up.
Trevor
So right there you said you are tired of NOT BEING CONDITIONNED, and make sure you are around for a long time, etc.

pick one? first you say you are unconditioned powerlifter, then you say you are superman...

I didn't say hey keep powerlifting you wuss...I just said you can be a powerlifter and still be conditionned. You are chosing to leave the heavy iron, and gear back, tired of powerlifting, that's all. I just hate seeing the stereotypes of fat unconditioned powerlifters which is why I chimed in.

Merely stating you are changing your priorities would have sufficed.
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:51 AM   #9
Trevor Probandt
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Not even close to superman boss

But yes, most powerlifters are not conditioned, and that is because they don't train to be conditioned and it doesn't help them, bench, squat, deadlift.

95% of the top powerlifters are not conditioned to do much of anything besides powerlift, and THAT is why they are the best at what they do. Just as most marathoners can't lift much because they don't care how much they snatch.

And just because your not fat doesn't mean you are not conditioned, I am a perfect example of that.

Thanks
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Old 01-01-2010, 02:58 PM   #10
Jay Ashman
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Re: Games in 2012, need programming help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor Probandt View Post
Not even close to superman boss

But yes, most powerlifters are not conditioned, and that is because they don't train to be conditioned and it doesn't help them, bench, squat, deadlift.

95% of the top powerlifters are not conditioned to do much of anything besides powerlift, and THAT is why they are the best at what they do. Just as most marathoners can't lift much because they don't care how much they snatch.

And just because your not fat doesn't mean you are not conditioned, I am a perfect example of that.

Thanks
Trevor, not to be all self-promoting and whatnot, but I am a pretty strong guy myself and I program my own workouts based around strength with good results from all my clients.

Check out the link in my sig line (strong island), I will be doing 5/3/1 in a couple weeks with conditioning/metcon work. Maybe that is something you would be interested in because of the strength work I include in it.

That may give you a good base to work off of to get some basic conditioning and CrossFit skills under your belt for the time being and then work on weak areas that you may have for skill work.

For example, you could do the strength, then metcon, then take a break and work on stuff that you have issues with like HSPU, muscle-ups, etc..

Worth a look, even if it is just for the programming suggestions.

I'm not a big fan of CFSB because it is too broad. It doesn't go into percentages nor deload days/weeks. It is just a simple linear progression program and my guess is that you won't do well on that because you are already pretty strong and you will need to do more of a wave progression like 5/3/1 to keep your lifts moving up nicely without overtraining, especially in a CrossFit-type program.

CFSB works wonders for a beginner lifter or one who is a low intermediate and still can do well with linear progression, but with your level of strength, I think 5/3/1 with metcons will be the answer.
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