CrossFit Discussion Board  

Go Back   CrossFit Discussion Board > Community > CrossPit
CrossFit Home Forum Site Rules CrossFit FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

CrossPit For discussing MMA, UFC, Pride fighting, and other martial arts

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-01-2007, 10:10 AM   #21
James Besenyei
Member James Besenyei is offline
 
James Besenyei's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cleveland  Ohio
Posts: 588
Good boxers have pretty fast hands, and good boxers have good footwork and good foot speed. Great boxers have great hands, great footwork, and great foot speed. The exact same statements are true of good MMA practitioners & great MMA practitioners. Look, I'm not saying that boxers aren't great fighters, nor am I saying that any MMA athlete could step into a ring and under boxing rules beat a boxer, many (indeed, maybe most?) would fail because it's a different sport, with different rules, different gloves, and different emphasis placed on differing aspects of technique & on fighting style in general. The exact same holds true for a boxer. If boxers in general are so good, then why aren't more local golden gloves champs simply getting into and dominating MMA, where, according to the argument you have presented, they could simply knock around all those lowly grapplers, rather than climbing the impossible ladder of corruption and the cornucopia of organizations that claim to run boxing? I say it's because MMA & boxing are different sports, and a boxer would find himself in a world of hurt if he relied completely upon his boxing skills in a ring with MMA rules & a competent MMA practitioner.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2007, 12:19 PM   #22
William John
Member William John is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Lowell  Mass
Posts: 34
I see what your saying and in regrads to boxers entering MMA instead of boxing why would they. The highest paid MMA fighter is around 350,000 boxers make so much more then that. I honestly believe MMA will fad in out, boxing is going to be around for ever its a classic with a much larger fan base just look at the ticket sales.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2007, 12:57 PM   #23
Garry Berryhill
Member Garry Berryhill is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Tulsa  OK
Posts: 158
One note:

Don't blame the gloves for a lack of knockouts. The boxing glove is the most destructive implement in sport. If boxers were to use the 4 ounce gloves that grapplers use (largely the same gloves boxers used at the turn of the 20th century) you would see a massive upswing in broken hands and facial cuts, but knockouts would remain flat (they might even decrease.)

There's a brilliant short film on Youtube that features the Guvnor speaking on just that point.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2007, 01:11 PM   #24
James Besenyei
Member James Besenyei is offline
 
James Besenyei's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cleveland  Ohio
Posts: 588
I don't know anyone who still watches or follows boxing with any regularity. Admittedly that's only one guy, in Ohio. This argument can go round & round. I don't know what the ticket sale comparisons are with any precision. Anecdotally I know that big ticket boxing events draw big crowds, just like big ticket MMA events. In Japan there are regularly 55,000 people at fights held at the Tokyo Dome, and they occur throughout the year, not just every once in awhile like big boxing events. UFC has several fights every year that draw crowds of 20,000-30,000 and huge PPV numbers for those fights, not to mention the TUF show on Spike; there are also great interactive websites like sherdog & MMA Weekly. There are the King of the Cage Events as well as BoDog Fight events and the IFL, which is broadcast on free TV and held in venues that hold 10-15,0000 people weekly throughout most of the year. MMA is pretty vibrant, and is not going to "fad out". Classic Boxing is classic (ALI, Marciano, Foreman, Sugar Ray, etc.), but boxing today has to earn that label, and it has fallen far short of that goal.

My point about boxers entering MMA is this: if boxers can dominate MMA athletes as easily as you say they can, and if we accept that not every boxer is going to make it in the world of boxing (even very good boxers never make it), then why aren't there more boxers attempting to make some money in MMA while waiting for their "big shot" in boxing? One would think that a boxer, if we take your premise that they can easily dominate MMA athletes to be true, would enter MMA immediately if a career in boxing was not a viable option.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 06:42 AM   #25
William John
Member William John is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Lowell  Mass
Posts: 34
I never said every boxer would dominate MMA, I think it would be hard for a grappler to get a hold of them. Boxers react very fast and they would see openings on MMA fighters and could easily KO them
Anyways why would a boxer await in MMA till a title shot comes up. You would have to sign a contract and then your stuck in MMA for so many fights.
If your going to fight MMA you should only train two sports, a stand up and a grappling this way when you see a opening you don't need to get confused with should I throw a knee,elbow, punch, kick or go for the take down.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 12:01 PM   #26
Jim Glover
Member Jim Glover is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Fort Gibson  Oklahoma
Posts: 79
Boxers also keep alot of weight on the front leg and would be easy picking for a quick takedown not to mention some serious damage from leg kicks. And I've yet to see any serious KO power in boxing recently. But comparing pure boxing to mma is apples to oranges. I love to train both.

William you are correct that alot of guys get into grappling because they don't want to take shots but grappling is not MMA.

Boxing is not dead but the promoters and the alphabet federations are strangling any kind of vibrancy out of it.

And I wouldn't echo anything Mayweather has to say about MMA, he actually recanted his statement after the De La Hoya fight in a post fight interview. There are great athletes in both fields and MMA has nowhere to go but up.

MMA is being highlighted on ESPN without being called human cockfighting or a blood sport, MMA is on the cover of SI, and MMA is available on pay cable and free TV as well.

I think MMA is going the right way in offering some of their big fights on regular TV. I don't think the Superbowl or the NBA playoffs would get near the viewers they do if they were on PPV and I believe boxing would be wise to go the same route.

Shoot I'd love to see something like 24/7 on ABC, CBS, NBC, or Fox. I may even start back watching TV on a regular basis again.

Will MMA be as big as boxing? Let's see in about 20 years.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 01:47 PM   #27
James Besenyei
Member James Besenyei is offline
 
James Besenyei's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cleveland  Ohio
Posts: 588
Well said Jim. Well argued William.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 04:05 PM   #28
Brad Davis
Member Brad Davis is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Blacksburg  VA
Posts: 608
William typed: "...I think it would be hard for a grappler to get a hold of them. Boxers react very fast and they would see openings on MMA fighters and could easily KO them."

Not wanting to start a flame war, but where've you been?

There have been pure boxers in MMA over the years and this absolutely hasn't happened on any consistent basis. Their speed and KO ability hasn't kept them from being taken to the ground and beat senseless or submitted. You seem to think grapplers are slow and can't avoid punches. This just isn't the case.

Boxers with grappling backgrounds, on the other hand, have done well. They use their takedown defense to keep the fight standing and eventually get the KO.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 06:42 PM   #29
William John
Member William John is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Lowell  Mass
Posts: 34
For the record I love both MMA and boxing, but honestly I believe MMA wil fade out. When MMA fighters stand up and exchange blows it awesome but those are rare fights, most of them end up on the ground. MMA stand up fights are awesome becuase they throw wild punches and that makes it entertaing, but those are rare. Most MMA fights end on the ground with a submission, most of the world hates this, espeically when they hype up a fight that ends in 30 seconds and we all paid for PPV.
I will be the first to admit boxing is dull right now, but I think it will come back espeically the lighter divsions.
As far as boxers dominating MMA I know they wouldn't they need take down defense and a solid grappling back round. But like some one already state a boxer with a solid grappling back round would due great because its the best stand up to know its simple, effective and devolpes a lot of power.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 10:47 PM   #30
James Besenyei
Member James Besenyei is offline
 
James Besenyei's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cleveland  Ohio
Posts: 588
William: "...most MMA fights end on the ground with a submission, most of the world hates this"

Not true. Most MMA fans I know can appreciate, in fact some prefer, when a fight goes to the ground and the technical battle begins or a vicious ground & pound is in the offing.

  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Liddell Boxing? Brandon Michael Enos CrossPit 12 04-24-2007 12:23 PM
Boxing training Elliot Royce CrossPit 17 11-01-2006 10:06 AM
Boxing in MD/DC/VA Steven Manns CrossPit 8 07-09-2006 09:02 AM
Crossfit and boxing? Matt Early Fitness 6 05-29-2006 12:33 PM
Boxing Gloves Bobbi Beglau Salvini Equipment 12 05-15-2006 09:44 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
CrossFit is a registered trademark of CrossFit Inc.