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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 09-04-2011, 03:51 PM   #1
Hunter Reed
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SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

I have been crossfitting for 2ish years, but doing bb stuff for only 1 or maybe a little under. i have made decent strides in the last 3 months doing mp wods and a few cffb wods sprinkled in. I am currently doing 5 on, 2 off, i am looking to to something along the lines of mp wod-swod-mp wod-swod-mp wod-rest-rest. I would like to see larger strides in my strength as well as gpp. I would also do a short metcon or gymnastics skill practice after the strength wods. I dont think going at the swods willy nilly would be at all optimal, being somewhat of a begginer, would it be a better idea to start with a 5x5, or would a mebb template be better for me? i have scoured cf forums and the general internet only to be more confused. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Im ready to get STRONG!
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Old 09-04-2011, 06:29 PM   #2
Brendan McNamar
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

What is an mp wod?
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Old 09-04-2011, 06:42 PM   #3
Brendan McNamar
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

Main page?

Usually referred to as Mainsite.

The usual course of action for someone like you is to run a simple linear progressions program until the easy gains end. Simple Strength & Conditioning (also known as 70's Big) is probably the best fit for a CrossFitter looking to get stronger. There is a lot of information on this forum about it.

Don't drive yourself crazy. Start with SS&CP for 3 months and by that time you will have a much better personal understanding of strength training and how your body personally reacts to it. You also won't lose all your metabolic conditioning like you would on SS or some of the others.

If you stall or really like it then CFSB or Conjugate will be the direction to head. I started down this road about 6 months ago and have gone through several of the programs as I learned more or stalled. It has been a great experience and early after I started I put my whole gym on a linear progression program. My members were like you. Good at met-cons with light weight but couldn't Rx WODs due to lack of strength. Now they are at or close to Rx weights.

Oh and I got a lot stronger and went from 178 to 190 without much gain in body fat. Fun times.
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Old 09-04-2011, 07:19 PM   #4
Jorge Montesinos
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

listen to wendler

(wfs?) heh "shrugs"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUk2zSvTlMo
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Old 09-04-2011, 08:15 PM   #5
David Meverden
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorge Montesinos View Post
listen to wendler

(wfs?) heh "shrugs"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUk2zSvTlMo
I think that's crap. "Lift for 10-12 years, and then start reading". I understand that he wants people to dive in and see what works for themselves but it is always better in every field of life everywhere to try to learn from people who have come before you. Are you going to try to be a physicist by doing experiments by yourself in your backyard? Hell no. You go, you read books. You go to college. You learn from EVERYONE YOU CAN, then you branch out on your own.

Why should I lift for 10-12 years dicking around trying to figure out how to get strong when I can just listen to people who have already gotten where I want to be? When I just went to the gym and did random machines and isolation stuff that seemed good I got nowhere. When I tried to come up with stuff on my own I was just treading water. Especially with strength I made strides when I listened to a coach who knew their **** and did what they said.

So that's my advice for the OP: Find someone who has what you want, and do what they say. If you don't get results you like, or if you've gotten all the results you can, then find someone else and do what THEY say. That's going to be the best way to get quality experience from which to branch out into some of your own stuff.

So, I vote for you either following CrossFit Football, the 70's Big program, or find an affiliate's programming who you like and follow that (CrossFit Fairbanks has an interesting Westside/CF hybrid going if you want that, and you can find threads recommending other affiliates). Find one that looks interesting and do it.
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Old 09-04-2011, 10:23 PM   #6
Jared Ashley
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

There's a million programs out there... they ALL work. Some better than others, but right now at 190 BW and a total of 695 you don't need to worry about that. They will all do what you describe. So my advice is very simple:

1) Pick the program you are most likely to follow. That probably means:
- It fits your schedule
- You just plain like it
- You have access to the necessary equipment

2) Start with weights that are pretty easy... build up to near-current maxes over at least 6-8 weeks.

3) Stick with the program, including at least one reset, until it stops working

4) When you've followed the first 3 steps and added 200-300+ lbs to your total, find someone who knows more than me.

Take it from someone who has a total 45 lbs higher than yours at a BW 45 lbs lower than yours, who has basically done all of the programs in your title line at one point or another. At the endpoint of each program I topped out with a total between 700 and 742, so I figure they're roughly equivalent.
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Old 09-05-2011, 10:13 AM   #7
David Meverden
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

Good advice Jared.

But, Hunter, you sounded confused so maybe you need even more help narrowing it down. So, lets try to get very specific:

1) How many days a week do you want to work out? Do you need the workouts to be short (start to finish <45 minutes) or can they be longer (1.5 hours)?

2) How important is conditioning to you? Are you willing to let conditioning slip or go completely while you gets stronger?

3) What equipment do you have? Just barbells? Barbells and dumbells? Barbells, dumbbells, bands, chains, box squat setup?

4) How confident are you in major lifts?

5) Do you want a simple program or is something more complicated acceptable?

6) What do you want more, barbell strength or gymnastic strength? Do you want lower body strength more than upper body strength?

7) Do you feel comfortable determining your own weaknesses and changing parts of the program to fit those weaknesses, or do you want something that is pretty much laid out 100% for you?

8) How much weight are you willing to gain?

9) How long do you want to be on this program? 2 months? 4 months? 6 months? 1 year? Indefinitely?

I think if you answer those questions I can run through a mental "what strength program should CrossFitter X use" flowchart and give you an answer.

Actually, maybe I should make that flowchart for real . . .
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Old 09-05-2011, 10:27 AM   #8
Scott Alexander
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

Having a flowchart like that would be pretty cool. It would certainly help guide the dozen's of folks who post asking which strength program is right for them.
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:59 AM   #9
David Meverden
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

I think I'm going to make it, or rather, make a spreadsheet in which you answer a series of questions and it tells you which program you should follow. Something like that.

Here's the programs I've got to include. They all have fairly well laid out programs, or at least templates (the westside is a little soft on that, though):
Starting Strength Novice Progression
Wendler 5/3/1
"Standard" Westside Template (2 ME, 2 DE days per week)
Grayskull LP
Conjugate CrossFit (Mason)
Lascek S&C
CrossFit Football
CrossFit Strength Bias
CrossFit Fairbanks Conjugate Program

Let me know if there are other programs you think I should include. The CF Fairbanks program looks like a good example of a CF/Westside program with both DE and ME work and one that is programmed for you. I didn't put in MEBB since I don't know where a well laid out program template for it is. I could put in a MadCows 5x5 but I don't know what question would lead me to to recommend it over starting strength or Grayskull LP.
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Old 09-05-2011, 12:54 PM   #10
Adam Dunn
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Re: SS, 5x5, 5/3/1, MEBB, CFSB? HELP!!!

David,

Go for it man, I think a lot of people on these boards would benefit. It seems like 69% of new threads in this section are similar to this one in that the OP is trying to figure out how to get stronger and wants to know what program is best.

I'd say I was in the same category 6 months ago and probably still am (looking to get stronger), but I pretty much just picked a program I liked and started actually doing it. I've done 70s Big (Lascek S&C) and I've had pretty good results even though spotty consistency in training. Once progress stops or I just get sick of it, time to try something different, maybe CF Football, Grayskull or Conjugate.

For those who do wanna think about it more carefully perhaps, I think what you're trying to do would be a good service.
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