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Old 09-27-2013, 04:00 PM   #61
Paulo Santos
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Talking Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Originally Posted by Todd Neal View Post
I'll add that everyone seems to love the idea that fat makes you fat, but carbs making you fat is like saying there is no god.
Too many calories make you fat. That simple. I'm eating 250 Gr of carbs per day (2150 calories per rest day and 2400 on workout days.) and I'm loosing 1/2# per week, just like I want to so that I don't loose strength.

There is a right way and a wrong way to do everything. Keto, Paleo, Carb Backloading, Zone, aren't miracle diets.

(I'm probably not going to explain this right). I did read somewhere that your body does burn things different. Meaning that if you eat 100 calories of protein, your body only burns about 80 of those calories (very officiant), but if you eat 100 calories of carbs, your body will use most of them (not as efficient). I think fats was closer to protein. So maybe your body is more efficient when on a Keto diet.
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Old 09-27-2013, 04:40 PM   #62
Todd Neal
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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So maybe your body is more efficient when on a Keto diet.
Yes. This is absolutely what I'm trying to say. I'll just add that your body is more efficient at burning fat when on a keto diet.

It sounds to me like your body, Paulo, is well adjusted to eating carbs, but unfortunately mine is not. Just like my friend who's body responds dramatically when he drinks milk while mine does not, my body responds to carbs while yours does not. And with 2/3 of the population being overweight, and 10% with diabetes, I'd say I'm not the only one.
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Old 09-27-2013, 05:59 PM   #63
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Originally Posted by Paulo Santos View Post
Too many calories make you fat. That simple. I'm eating 250 Gr of carbs per day (2150 calories per rest day and 2400 on workout days.) and I'm loosing 1/2# per week, just like I want to so that I don't loose strength.

There is a right way and a wrong way to do everything. Keto, Paleo, Carb Backloading, Zone, aren't miracle diets.

(I'm probably not going to explain this right). I did read somewhere that your body does burn things different. Meaning that if you eat 100 calories of protein, your body only burns about 80 of those calories (very officiant), but if you eat 100 calories of carbs, your body will use most of them (not as efficient). I think fats was closer to protein. So maybe your body is more efficient when on a Keto diet.
The thermogenic effect. 99/100 fat, 74/100 carbs, and protein is in the 60's I think. I don't say carbs don't make people fat. The notion that simply eating them makes you fat is ridiculoous though. If I ate one chicken breast and a whole bottle of EVOO over th course of a day every day. I would get fat even though I am not eating carbs. Keto people come here and act like you can eat fat unlimited and the laws of thermodynamics cease to exist. Likewise, acting as thought a few hundered carbs within your expenditure rate for the day is going to make you fat is silly too.
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Old 09-27-2013, 06:03 PM   #64
Larry Bruce
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

Ketones are less efficient as an energy source - only 2 of the 3 subtypes are processed for energy. A large % of the 3rd gets excreted.

There are fewer calories available to be stored or used for energy when metabolizing protein because of thermogenesis , and in generally in ketosis because they aren't all usable and because of extra work the body does to rid itself of by-products. The slight acidosis may also impair recovery.

Neither are the best energy sources, but if you rarely exceed 80% max I doubt it would make much difference to performance. After a while you will adapt. But if you are used to exceeding 80% it's going to be hard to make up the difference.

Last edited by Larry Bruce : 09-27-2013 at 06:05 PM.
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Old 09-27-2013, 06:44 PM   #65
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Originally Posted by Larry Bruce View Post
Ketones are less efficient as an energy source - only 2 of the 3 subtypes are processed for energy. A large % of the 3rd gets excreted.

There are fewer calories available to be stored or used for energy when metabolizing protein because of thermogenesis , and in generally in ketosis because they aren't all usable and because of extra work the body does to rid itself of by-products. The slight acidosis may also impair recovery.

Neither are the best energy sources, but if you rarely exceed 80% max I doubt it would make much difference to performance. After a while you will adapt. But if you are used to exceeding 80% it's going to be hard to make up the difference.
Larry, I ain't got time for percentages, max out everyday!!! Modertion is for the weak!
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Old 09-27-2013, 07:23 PM   #66
Larry Bruce
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Larry, I ain't got time for percentages, max out everyday!!! Modertion is for the weak!
Bill you are one funny guy!
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Old 09-27-2013, 07:52 PM   #67
Bill M. Hesse
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Bill you are one funny guy!
Too dry in these parts anymore, someone had to step up!
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Old 09-28-2013, 09:32 AM   #68
Michael Dries
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

Interesting conversation thus far, with some nice sprinkling of sarcasm here and there.

I'm still curious as to how a ketogenic approach to something like Wendler's 5/3/1 Boring but big style training would work.

Figure that half of the training is higher intensity, waves of 5reps at 65/75/85%, 3 reps at 70/80/90%, and 5@75,3@85,1@95. Granted the last sets are pushed to near failure.

Then follow that up with 5 sets of 8-12 reps in the 50%-70% range. Sprinkle in some accessory work such as chins and core work in the 3-5 sets of 10 rep range.

One could figure that ketosis should impact the bare minimum intensity rep schemes, 5,3,1 but could have an effect on the final sets that are meant to be pushed above the required rep range, 5+ ,3+, 1+.

I would imagine glycogen stores would be burned pretty well on the 5x10 @70% sets especially if on keeps the recovery time to 90seconds or so between sets.

I guess it all comes down to self experimentation.

Last edited by Michael Dries : 09-28-2013 at 09:36 AM.
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Old 09-28-2013, 11:12 AM   #69
Paulo Santos
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Originally Posted by Michael Dries View Post
Interesting conversation thus far, with some nice sprinkling of sarcasm here and there.

I'm still curious as to how a ketogenic approach to something like Wendler's 5/3/1 Boring but big style training would work.

Figure that half of the training is higher intensity, waves of 5reps at 65/75/85%, 3 reps at 70/80/90%, and 5@75,3@85,1@95. Granted the last sets are pushed to near failure.

Then follow that up with 5 sets of 8-12 reps in the 50%-70% range. Sprinkle in some accessory work such as chins and core work in the 3-5 sets of 10 rep range.

One could figure that ketosis should impact the bare minimum intensity rep schemes, 5,3,1 but could have an effect on the final sets that are meant to be pushed above the required rep range, 5+ ,3+, 1+.

I would imagine glycogen stores would be burned pretty well on the 5x10 @70% sets especially if on keeps the recovery time to 90seconds or so between sets.

I guess it all comes down to self experimentation.
I would experiment, but if all you are doing is lifting, you should be OK.
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Old 09-30-2013, 01:53 AM   #70
Dare Vodusek
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Re: What can low-carb (ketosis) do for you?

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Originally Posted by Bill M. Hesse View Post
How can you say "that" article is full of mis-information and then post a study that is the same? Study is bunk, only a randomised control study - increased PUFA was the only controlled, and known about, constant variable - who's to say that people weren't eating pure meat low carb diets, or maybe fatty foods and lots of soft drinks - plus no control on exercise or activity etc etc

Check sources of "that" article, Dr. Mary Enig is a world authority:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_G._Enig

This is her work on poly: http://www.westonaprice.org/know-you...-on-fats/#poly
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