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Old 10-04-2013, 05:58 AM   #1
David Finney
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Kipping Pullups

I decided yesterday that I'm going to have to give up on kipping pullups. I think I've had too many injuries in the past to my shoulder, and the swinging movement of the kip has just aggravated it too much. After doing a few workouts with strict pullups (maybe a little kip at the bottom), I'm happy with the decision, and I think that I may see more benefit from it.

I know there is a lot of "controversy" between Crossfit and the outside world about the kip, so I don't want to beat a dead horse here. I certainly don't think they're "cheating," but I am starting to think that for the general masses not interested in the games, it may be better to stick a strict pullup. Does anyone else have any experience with injuries on the kipping pullup? Or, has anyone given them up and seen a benefit?
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Old 10-04-2013, 06:19 AM   #2
Jeremy Schultz
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Re: Kipping Pullups

Without starting an endless debate over for the millionth time - IMO the only benefit of kipping is to shorten your WOD time. In other words, yes, strict pullups have many benefits that kipping pullups don't. Less chance of injury is probably the most important one, though, in the scheme of life.
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Old 10-04-2013, 10:20 AM   #3
Brendan McNamar
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Re: Kipping Pullups

Healthy, properly functioning and strong shoulders are a requirement for safe kipping pull-ups.

Anyone who is missing 1 of these three elements is better off strict until they fix the issue. If it can't be fixed then they should stay strict.

To do 100% of CrossFit movements safely you need a 100% healthy, correctly functioning body. If you don't have this then modification should be made to adjust to your circumstances.

This is one of the many values of belonging to a well coached Affiliate.
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Old 10-04-2013, 10:41 AM   #4
Mike Doehla
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Re: Kipping Pullups

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendan McNamar View Post
Healthy, properly functioning and strong shoulders are a requirement for safe kipping pull-ups.

Anyone who is missing 1 of these three elements is better off strict until they fix the issue. If it can't be fixed then they should stay strict.

To do 100% of CrossFit movements safely you need a 100% healthy, correctly functioning body. If you don't have this then modification should be made to adjust to your circumstances.

This is one of the many values of belonging to a well coached Affiliate.
how would you know when someone is ready?
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Old 10-05-2013, 03:00 PM   #5
Blair Robert Lowe
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Re: Kipping Pullups

When they have established a strength base.

When they have mastered the basic kipping action of arch>hollow

Put them in a band and allow them to do it slowly.

When they don't complain of any shoulder wincing or shoulder issues day in, day out.

I can kip for some workouts but I always know I'm gonna pay for it if done in high volume.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:04 AM   #6
Brendan McNamar
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Re: Kipping Pullups

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Originally Posted by Mike Doehla View Post
how would you know when someone is ready?
Instead of saying 100% someone is ready I look for reasons they are not ready.

1) History of shoulder injury

2) Current pain after activities involving shoulder movement.

3) Inability to do PVC pipe pass throughs both directions with a correct snatch grip, hands tight on the pipe and elbows locked the whole time.

4) Generally low upper body strength levels, particularly in women.

5) The combination of high body fat / low muscle mass. This person will require a huge kip to over come the extra weight and is driving that energy through the shoulder that is not protected/supported by the surrounding muscles.

You have to evaluate each situation independently. I have an ex-power lifter who has very tight shoulders but is going to be doing muscle ups in no time because he has so much strength. He is eating Paleo, his weight is dropping into place quickly and his shoulders are well developed and strong. I consider him low risk even though he needs to continue to work on his flexibility.

I have an ex professional rugby player with multiple shoulder injuries and surgeries who may never be able to kip safely. With his history kipping pull-ups are the least of my concerns.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:17 AM   #7
Mike Doehla
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Re: Kipping Pullups

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blair Robert Lowe View Post
When they have established a strength base.

When they have mastered the basic kipping action of arch>hollow

Put them in a band and allow them to do it slowly.

When they don't complain of any shoulder wincing or shoulder issues day in, day out.

I can kip for some workouts but I always know I'm gonna pay for it if done in high volume.
did you see main sites wod today? 150 pull ups lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendan McNamar View Post
Instead of saying 100% someone is ready I look for reasons they are not ready.

1) History of shoulder injury

2) Current pain after activities involving shoulder movement.

3) Inability to do PVC pipe pass throughs both directions with a correct snatch grip, hands tight on the pipe and elbows locked the whole time.

4) Generally low upper body strength levels, particularly in women.

5) The combination of high body fat / low muscle mass. This person will require a huge kip to over come the extra weight and is driving that energy through the shoulder that is not protected/supported by the surrounding muscles.

You have to evaluate each situation independently. I have an ex-power lifter who has very tight shoulders but is going to be doing muscle ups in no time because he has so much strength. He is eating Paleo, his weight is dropping into place quickly and his shoulders are well developed and strong. I consider him low risk even though he needs to continue to work on his flexibility.

I have an ex professional rugby player with multiple shoulder injuries and surgeries who may never be able to kip safely. With his history kipping pull-ups are the least of my concerns.
Thank you
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:29 AM   #8
David Finney
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Re: Kipping Pullups

I think I'm going to stick to strict. Its not a strength issue (I have a strict bar muscle up), I think its repeated injury to my rotator cuff from crashing on snowbaords, bikes, skis, motorcycles, etc. I feel the pain when I'm stretched all the way forward on the kip. I also get a lot of "popping" when I'm strict pressing overhead, and I'm guessing they're related. Maybe some mobility work? Anyone have any specific suggestions?
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:37 AM   #9
Glenn Plomchok
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Re: Kipping Pullups

David,

Having laid off bar kipping of any sort for the past 2-3 months I will say just doing this will help. By that I mean no TTB, K2E or kipping pull ups. I have been doing all PU's strict...

What I have been doing for mobilization is spending 15 min or so with the lacrosse ball . Start on traps and rotate my arm up/down/around then move to shoulder blades and rear delts and any area where I feel I am tight. I then turn around and do my front delts moving my arm as before to change the angle the ball is hitting the muscle. I then hit my pecs and triceps. After this, I hit some dislocates then do some static pull stretches with a band. This all takes 15-20 minutes...but it has helped a ton.

I will say after doing a lot of strict and strict weighted pull ups my left elbow is tender. Seems like it is always something
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:39 AM   #10
David Finney
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Re: Kipping Pullups

Thanks Glenn, I'll try that out.
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