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Old 07-15-2011, 05:56 PM   #51
David Z Sachs
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

As said before, weight loss/gain is about calories in/out.

The reason a lot of people see great results for weight loss on a paleo type diet is simply because it's hard as hell to eat too much on chicken breast and broccoli. If you're trying to lose weight, eat less calories than you expend. Foods that fill you up for fewer calories do the trick.

I really don't believe theres more to it, that low carb, high carb, low fat, etc. play a significant role in weight loss - in overall health, perhaps, but not in weight loss.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08...sor/index.html

I'm sure it's been posted and isn't exactly the best source of science for a diet, but the guy lost almost 30 pounds eating twinkies.
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Old 07-15-2011, 08:57 PM   #52
Zach S
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Z Sachs View Post
As said before, weight loss/gain is about calories in/out.

The reason a lot of people see great results for weight loss on a paleo type diet is simply because it's hard as hell to eat too much on chicken breast and broccoli. If you're trying to lose weight, eat less calories than you expend. Foods that fill you up for fewer calories do the trick.

I really don't believe theres more to it, that low carb, high carb, low fat, etc. play a significant role in weight loss - in overall health, perhaps, but not in weight loss.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08...sor/index.html

I'm sure it's been posted and isn't exactly the best source of science for a diet, but the guy lost almost 30 pounds eating twinkies.
Yes when your talking about weight, fat loss is not so simple.
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Old 07-16-2011, 03:59 PM   #53
Rob Samuels
 
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

Calories in/calories out as in food consumption vs exercise is most certainly not a complete equation unless you are reading 1980's health books from the 8th grade. Is that really in debate?
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Old 07-16-2011, 04:30 PM   #54
Kevin Burns
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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Originally Posted by David Z Sachs View Post
I really don't believe theres more to it, that low carb, high carb, low fat, etc. play a significant role in weight loss - in overall health, perhaps, but not in weight loss.
Do you not believe in the hormone Insulin either ?
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Old 07-16-2011, 09:59 PM   #55
David Z Sachs
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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Originally Posted by Rob Samuels View Post
Calories in/calories out as in food consumption vs exercise is most certainly not a complete equation unless you are reading 1980's health books from the 8th grade. Is that really in debate?
If your body burns more calories than you consume you will lose weight. I'm not talking about going on a treadmill for 1.5 hours and looking at how much you "burned", I'm talking about your BMR + exercise - calories consumed. I lost weight eating mostly crap food by simply counting my calories - I started at 260ish and lost over 65lbs eating white rice, hamburger meat, bread, and diet soda. It has nothing to do with exercise. If you simply eat less than your BMR I believe you'll lose weight. Again, it may not be the healthy way, and it's likely you're messing up your metabolism and losing more muscle than fat, but you will lose weight.


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Originally Posted by Kevin Burns View Post
Do you not believe in the hormone Insulin either ?
Sure I do. I also believe that calories in/out has a more significant role in weight loss, as I ate mostly foods with high glycemic index/loads while I lost over 65lbs. Do I believe it was the healthy way to lose weight now that I'm slightly more knowledgeable? No. But the weight still came off by simply measuring what I was eating and counting every calorie. When I stalled I dropped calories by 150 or so each time and lost more weight.

I believe what has worked for me. Do I eat this way now? No. But I still believe that if you consume less calories than you burn, you will lose weight. Muscle more than fat? Perhaps. But once again, I do what I know works.

I was actually gaining weight on a paleo diet when I started it. Why? Because my first crossfit coach told me to eat as much as I wanted as long as it was paleo. So what did I do? I ate probably 1300 calories worth of almonds a day, which have a GI of zero, so should technically have little to no effect on my insulin levels. What else did I do? Gain over 10lbs in a month of mostly fat. I asked my coach whats up, should I cut back on anything? Nope, it's because I wasn't eating enough, so I looked in my log and added it up, I was eating almost 5000 calories a day while doing crossfit 4 days a work, mostly metcons. And I was still told I wasn't eating enough, that's why I was gaining weight. Started counting calories again and started losing weight again.
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Old 07-16-2011, 10:15 PM   #56
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Z Sachs View Post
If your body burns more calories than you consume you will lose weight. I'm not talking about going on a treadmill for 1.5 hours and looking at how much you "burned", I'm talking about your BMR + exercise - calories consumed. I lost weight eating mostly crap food by simply counting my calories - I started at 260ish and lost over 65lbs eating white rice, hamburger meat, bread, and diet soda. It has nothing to do with exercise. If you simply eat less than your BMR I believe you'll lose weight. Again, it may not be the healthy way, and it's likely you're messing up your metabolism and losing more muscle than fat, but you will lose weight.
Yup. You can't argue with thermodynamics.

It's true that the body can and will adjust BMR depending on a number of factors, but that's only possible within a relatively small range.

Katherine
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Old 07-17-2011, 07:48 AM   #57
Seth Leaman
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
Yup. You can't argue with thermodynamics.

It's true that the body can and will adjust BMR depending on a number of factors, but that's only possible within a relatively small range.

Katherine
But...But Katherine, the laws of thermodynamics only apply to closed systems, which the body is not sorry, had to beat the Gary Taubes reciters to it.

I don't think most people even understand how the body works in regards to fat/weight loss, nor how insulin works. I don't even care about the usual argument that it is the most anabolic hormone. We know that. Please read this article (at least the first page) http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=319 (wfs) Pay special attention to the first diagram showing rises and falls in insulin.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:50 AM   #58
Darryl Shaw
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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But...But Katherine, the laws of thermodynamics only apply to closed systems, which the body is not sorry, had to beat the Gary Taubes reciters to it.
"The more I read of Good Calories, Bad Calories, the more I think Taubes is a supercilious ignorant twat. He's got literally EVERYTHING wrong and anybody relying on 1930's textbooks to make a point is just too stupid to deal with." - Lyle McDonald. (wfs)
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:54 AM   #59
Lewis Dunn
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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Originally Posted by Seth Leaman View Post
Pay special attention to the first diagram showing rises and falls in insulin.
Do you mean the chart labeled "This is just a rough chart that I made...."?
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Old 07-17-2011, 10:00 AM   #60
Lewis Dunn
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Re: Lower Fat vs Lower Carb study

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Originally Posted by Darryl Shaw View Post
"The more I read of Good Calories, Bad Calories, the more I think Taubes is a supercilious ignorant twat. He's got literally EVERYTHING wrong and anybody relying on 1930's textbooks to make a point is just too stupid to deal with." - Lyle McDonald.[/url] (wfs)
I'm actually a Taubes fan, but I love this quote because it has Lyle McDonald calling someone else supercilious! And, of course, it's so much easier to say that someone is too stupid to deal with instead of actually dealing with them.
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