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Old 06-01-2008, 12:31 PM   #11
David Gessen
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

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Originally Posted by Veronica Davis View Post
David - The leading with your butt is right, but you are dropping your chest forward to do it. You are almost doing a good morning.
and how do I fix that?

I remember you've posted a morning meal, eggs and oatmeal mixed.
going to try that tommorow morning, now preparing
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Old 06-01-2008, 02:08 PM   #12
Alex Nisetich
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

David,

Shoulders over the bar is a wording issue, your arms should be locked out over it, which in most people means that your shoulder visibly will be forward of the bar. You're correct to say that you should lead with your butt in the squat, but it should barely be perceptible, and your torso should not lead forward to initiate that hip drive.

Work on lower back strength -deadlifts, cleans, back extensions, good mornings, etc. -and this should become less of a problem. Your internal abdominals (transverse abdominis is the big one I believe) are also important for keeping your torso in the same position throughout the squat. Just doing more squats will strengthen these -deadlifts, presses, pullups, KB swings and Oly lifts are also very effective.

When squatting, concentrate on keeping your torso upright while still using hip drive to move the bar. Keep your eyes on one spot a few feet in front of you during the whole lift and don't move your head or eyes and your torso shouldn't move as much.
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Old 06-01-2008, 04:03 PM   #13
Veronica Davis
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

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Originally Posted by David Gessen View Post
and how do I fix that?

I remember you've posted a morning meal, eggs and oatmeal mixed.
going to try that tommorow morning, now preparing
What Alex said. Developing your core strength give you the ability to avoid the lean forward. Box squats are also an effective way to improve squat form. Start with a box that is parallel and each time you do them lower the box.


Good luck with the pancakes!!!
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Old 06-01-2008, 04:08 PM   #14
Brandon Oto
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

But you're right that a bit of a hip rise is okay and signifies good hip drive.

I'm actually not that concerned with what you've got now, but yeah, you could clean it up a little.
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Old 06-03-2008, 08:21 PM   #15
John Keiper
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

Please do yourself a favor and get on WESTSIDE BARBELL or ELITEFTS websites and read some of the articles these guys have up. This will answer all of your form questions ans then some. These guys are the real deal. A few quick things. The squat begins with the hips breaking first not the knees. Sit BACK and down. Like some of the others have said keep your arms straight when you deadlift. It is possible to bend them with light weights but heavy stuff will get you into bicep tearing territory. In the deadlift the shoulders should never be in front of the bar. This is poor technique. You want them behind the bar so you can pull back and use your own weight to help the bar rise. Kinda like counterbalancing the bar so to speak. Hope this helps. Remember sometimes you have to go lighter to get stronger.
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Old 06-04-2008, 06:19 AM   #16
David Gessen
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

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Originally Posted by John Keiper View Post
Please do yourself a favor and get on WESTSIDE BARBELL or ELITEFTS websites and read some of the articles these guys have up. This will answer all of your form questions ans then some. These guys are the real deal. A few quick things. The squat begins with the hips breaking first not the knees. Sit BACK and down. Like some of the others have said keep your arms straight when you deadlift. It is possible to bend them with light weights but heavy stuff will get you into bicep tearing territory. In the deadlift the shoulders should never be in front of the bar. This is poor technique. You want them behind the bar so you can pull back and use your own weight to help the bar rise. Kinda like counterbalancing the bar so to speak. Hope this helps. Remember sometimes you have to go lighter to get stronger.
Well, I guess you know more than Mark Rippetoe...
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Old 06-04-2008, 07:57 AM   #17
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

David,

John is discussing a powerlifting deadlift and squat. In the squat he's talking about, the legs are wider than what we use and what Rip suggests. In that case, the shins stay almost verticle. As far the deadlift, I'm not sure what causes the difference.
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Old 06-04-2008, 08:22 AM   #18
Brandon Oto
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

It's just different cues. Biomechanically the scapulae sit over the bar when it comes off the ground, but many powerlifters like to think about getting behind it.
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Old 06-04-2008, 08:23 AM   #19
John Keiper
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

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Originally Posted by David Gessen View Post
Well, I guess you know more than Mark Rippetoe...
Sorry if it seemded that way but that is not what I intended. Hard to get emotion out over a computer i quess. And yes I was mainly talking about powerlifting style movements as this seems to be the style that was used in the video.
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Old 06-04-2008, 09:03 AM   #20
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: Deadlift, squat and power clean

John,

David is just learning all this stuff and I don't think is well versed in the different yet accepted variances in lifting techniques. Also, most people here hold Rip in high regard, and can become somewhat defensive.

David,

I would be careful about dismissing information coming out of Westside. They have produced some impressive lifters and Rip mentions their dynamic lift protocol often and is in agreement.
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