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Old 03-18-2011, 09:55 AM   #21
Nalin Prabhu
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Steven Low View Post
So you're either confused or incorrectly wording it
Neither.. (i think)

I'll have to find the video when I get home, but it was in the Journal.
He advocates a wider stance, but with the toes pointed forward.
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Old 03-18-2011, 10:00 AM   #22
Donald Lee
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Steven Low View Post
Toes out implies more hip external rotation. MOre hip external rotation = wider stance. The opposite is true... toes forward stances with knee tracking over toes = narrow stance.

So you're either confused or incorrectly wording it
Nalin is right. Louie does advocate toes forward squat stance. I don't remember why, but I'm going to guess it has to do with active insuffiency.
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Old 03-18-2011, 11:37 AM   #23
Chad Anderson
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Struan Potter View Post
That would seem rather odd to me. What would be the point of mobilizing a better squat position to then do a weighted squat in a not as optimal position?

Besides his feet are rather straight here http://media.crossfit.com/cf-video/C...ckSquatTip.mov
The primary thrust of this thread is about squatting stance. Virtually all Strength, Oly and Power Lifting literature speaks of the standard squat stance being slight toes out in a natural stance that lines up with your femur.

Oly tends to keep a slightly narrower stance which requires a bit more hip and ankle flexibility. CF has a lot of Oly movements so it makes sense to work on keeping the stance in a bit which by nature then brings the toes in to match the femur angle.

Toes in stretching helps me work the areas that don't let me drop into the hole as easy. I still use a slightly wider and more toes out position for back squat as it is simply more comfortable when I get to the heavy poundages.
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Old 03-18-2011, 08:31 PM   #24
Steven Low
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Nalin Prabhu View Post
Neither.. (i think)

I'll have to find the video when I get home, but it was in the Journal.
He advocates a wider stance, but with the toes pointed forward.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald Lee View Post
Nalin is right. Louie does advocate toes forward squat stance. I don't remember why, but I'm going to guess it has to do with active insuffiency.
Doens't make sense.

If you're saying that the legs are slightly outside shoulder width or something (e.g. what is a "wider stance" compared to shoulder width) with toes still pointed mostly forwards then yes that it very close to "narrow" stance as opposed to something like a stance for sumo deadlifts which is an ACTUAL "wide stance"

I'm assuming this is the case otherwise you're still not making sense.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:36 AM   #25
Tyson Henrie
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

Thank you everyone for responding.

It seems that the consensus stands at feet shoulder width apart with toes pointed slightly outwards. This agrees with what I feel in my own workouts and what I see my athletes doing. They can lift more weight comfortably when in this position. My knees always hurt if I slack from this position. So I'm either stronger there, or my mechanics are just used to it that way.

Back to the main subject of this post: My girls need to gain strength in their hamstrings to protect their knees. They need to not let their knees collapse inwards and go below parallel in their squats. Toes pointed in or out depends entirely on their ROM and mechanics.

I have talked with their head coach and she has promised to stay out of their conditioning time with me. Last practice went much better and the girls made some improvements in their squats. I also talked to them about proper running and jumping mechanics as well. If anyone has any resources for that sort of stuff, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:44 AM   #26
Nicholas Borek
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

The way Louie teaches the squat stance, at least on the box, makes my knees hurt just by looking at it. For me, I can only do toes pointed out or else my garbage left knee just wont do it without pain and I think thats a pretty common experience.
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Old 03-22-2011, 12:13 PM   #27
Jim Romagna
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

This thread got way off the original subject, which Tyson, you answered with your final post. The coach should coach soccer, and let the strength coach coach strength. Period. The longer you do this as a profession and the more you produce results and grow a positive reputation, the more people will leave you alone and trust you to do your job.

I once had a grad assistant strength coach that ran into this very problem 2 years into his own full time job. The basketball coach wanted the girls (college) lifting 4 days a week in season. He asked me how to approach it. I said tell her your the strength coach and you got hired to do your job because of your credentials and your experience, so ask that she let you do your job.

Of course a collabrative effort with coach is the best relationship, but ultimately, when they are in your domain (your training facility) they do what you prescribe.
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Old 03-22-2011, 12:31 PM   #28
Steven Low
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Jim Romagna View Post
This thread got way off the original subject, which Tyson, you answered with your final post. The coach should coach soccer, and let the strength coach coach strength. Period. The longer you do this as a profession and the more you produce results and grow a positive reputation, the more people will leave you alone and trust you to do your job.

I once had a grad assistant strength coach that ran into this very problem 2 years into his own full time job. The basketball coach wanted the girls (college) lifting 4 days a week in season. He asked me how to approach it. I said tell her your the strength coach and you got hired to do your job because of your credentials and your experience, so ask that she let you do your job.

Of course a collabrative effort with coach is the best relationship, but ultimately, when they are in your domain (your training facility) they do what you prescribe.
Agreed.
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Old 03-24-2011, 09:47 AM   #29
Aidan Macdonald
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

When people don't want to listen/learn about squats, I have them do burpees or up downs.

I am assuming you are having them air squat. If not this doesn't apply.

Burpees add another element to the "squat" movement. This element confuses them and they forget to do the squat "properly". So they do it naturally, which I have found to be usually correct.
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Old 03-24-2011, 09:57 AM   #30
Veronica Carpenter
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Re: Young female athletes and squatting

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Originally Posted by Aidan Macdonald View Post
Burpees add another element to the "squat" movement. This element confuses them and they forget to do the squat "properly". So they do it naturally, which I have found to be usually correct.
Tricky! They probably won't notice their knees going forward of their toes either.
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