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Old 11-05-2004, 04:56 PM   #1
Matt McManmon
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What is the logic behind this cycling? why is it needed? Also if your training extremely intensely 6days on 1 day off, has anyone had better results with maybe 10 on 3 off? my thinking behind this is that the intense training would drain whatever creatine stores you built up over the 10 day period much quicker then usual
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Old 11-05-2004, 11:13 PM   #2
Barry Cooper
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All I know is I started taking a teaspoon a day and promptly put on 10 pounds. 247 today. I'm going to stop taking it for a while.
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Old 11-06-2004, 07:24 AM   #3
Paul Theodorescu
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Quick additional question: I've never taken Creatine because I imagined it would help initially and then I'd have to keep taking it to maintain my gains. Would be more accurate to say that it continually improves strength and recovery?
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Old 11-06-2004, 09:14 AM   #4
Beth Moscov
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The research I read seems to be mixed but some says that, while muscle size gains will be lost when you stop taking it, the strength gains will be maintained.

It is useful to be careful with creatine. While all the research I read said that it was not at all correlated with increased blood pressure, when I took it, my blood pressure skyrocketed. I didn't think it was related and the doctors were worried. When I stopped creatine, within two days my blood pressure was normal again. I decided to retest and after a few weeks tried to take it again and test my blood pressure. In two days of taking creatine, I was back into the dangerous realm and it dropped right back down two days after stopping it.

I tend to have odd reactions to foods and medicines but it is worth paying attention. It is easy to get a blood pressure reading about a week after starting to see if you have this sort of reaction or not.
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Old 11-06-2004, 10:09 AM   #5
Larry Lindenman
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I started taking it again. No loading phase, 3g a day. While it is intellgent to cycle I know of no research which reports negative effects of being "on" all the time. The strength gains come from (i believe) creatine stores allowing the muscle to recover from one bout of exercise (a set) and the ability to shorten rest periods wothout lowering weight. This would allow you to lift a greater volume per time period and would result in strength gains. Weigh gain occurs due to water retention, which would explain Beth's blood pressure reaction. I believe you need far less than advertised (3g as opposed to 5g) and loading is not necessary. I just dump three grams in my morning coffee. The stuff is dirt cheap, so I'm going to use it over the winter. The only advise I would give is experiment and see if it works for you.
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Old 11-06-2004, 10:20 AM   #6
Matt Hilliard
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I know when I took it I got horrible side effects.
Including high blood pressure and getting sick.
I went to to the doctor and he said my liver enzymes were through the roof and advised that I get off of it and anything else I was on. Within a couple of days I was feeling great. He said that creatine causes your body and muscles to reatin water and that was bad for the liver and urinary tract. That was just me though,for some people it works great.
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Old 11-06-2004, 05:59 PM   #7
Michael Hill
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I'd like to get your opinions on a newer type of creatine, the product description is as follows:

" Proteinfactory introduces a new form of creatine monohydrate. CREATINE P/12 is a patented creatine. Which means that the product is so unique and inventive that the makers have patented it. The main problem with all existing creatine supplements, is the ability to deliver a concentrated amount of creatine to the system. Patent Pending Research proves that these prior creatine arts actually have the human body ingesting creatinine (a poison and toxic by product). Over the years we have read and seen all types of advertisements for the purity of creatine. Everyone has claimed that their creatine product contains less creatinine than the next. Then you have companies trying to come up with unique ways to make creatine "work" better, such as adding 100 grams of dextrose. This is a proven way to have creatine produce better results. But, this was only partially factual, or at least until the bottle was opened. When a bodybuilder uses creatine, common side effects occur, such as stomach craps, dehydration, nausea, headaches, and excess water retention.

They are caused by the body’s defense to a toxic compound called creatinine. Creatinine is synthesized in the liver, pancreas and kidneys. Our bodies’ internal defense mechanism to save itself from this ingested poison is to try and dilute the toxin with water. Creatinine is very toxic and extremely dangerous. Creatinine comes from creatine monohydrate being instantaneously converted into creatinine, upon the addition of fluid or introduction into the stomach via capsules or tablets. The lower the PH the quicker the total conversion. Most common creatine products including liquid and effervescent creatine products have PH levels between 3 and 7. This equates to a conversion to creatinine in less than 10 minutes. Creatine products with a ph of 3 converted to creatinine in less than 1 minute. Our CREATINE P/12 on the other hand has a ph level of 12. Tests on CREATINE P/12 showed a ZERO conversion to creatinine. Thus the differences are "night and day". By using a creatine product with a high PH level you can be sure your getting 100% creatine with NO creatinine. In conclusion, if you have always gotten sick from creatine, if you have never seen results you were hoping with from regular creatine than you should be using CREATINE P/12. If you have been using Creapure from Degussa or Pfansteihl and been getting optimal results than stick with Creapure and Pfansteihl. The old saying, "If its not broken, dont fix it. "

Has anyone every used this? What do you think of these claims? Does anyone know of any studies relating to creatine and ph levels? Logically, there must be something different about this product because it says you only need to take 1-2 grams a day for optimal results. Also, it's come out to about the same price when adjusted for the dosage differences.

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Old 11-06-2004, 10:29 PM   #8
Andrew Gray
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I am by no means an expert but here is what I have heard about Creatine. I heard you are supposed to drink a lot of water while taking it. I assume that helps prevent the dehydration. Also I heard someone say that women should not use it. I have no idea what the reason is for that or if the person knew what they were talking about though. I have heard some people say you need to cycle it or your body adapts and the effects weaken. The guy at the store where I bought my creatine told me there is no need to cycle it.

I used creatine for a couple months while trying to rehab after breaking my ankle but it's hard for me to attribute anything directly to creatine. Yes, my leg got much much stronger, but it was starting from a state of atrophe for the past 6 weeks and had virtually no muscle to begin with. I also didn't have anything to really compare my progress with. I never got sick while taking it or felt any side effects. I gained a little bit of weight (5 pounds), but I don't know if it was from the creatine or just from getting active lifting again. The weight stayed on after I stopped using it. While I was lifting I felt like my biceps, triceps, and forarms were quite swollen and tight.

The creatine I used is called Triple Fusion by MM Sports Nutrition. It says it has some sort of built in delivery system to get the creatine to the muscles. It also claims to use a bicarbonate to "assist in rapid assimilation and to act as a stomach buffer." One serving has 5g Creatine, 5g Glutamine, and 5g Glycine. It says to take "1-2 scoops once or twice a day." I used 1 scoop twice a day.

I am thinking about trying it out again. I have been trying to put on weight for rugby and I think creatine might be able to help me out with that. I am interested to see what everyone here has to say about it.
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Old 11-07-2004, 06:53 AM   #9
Larry Lindenman
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Creatine is creatine all the hype is B.S. Get cheap powder creatine if your going to give it a try. Don't load, use 3 - 5g a day. Mix with hot tea (disolves better). Try it for a month, if you don't feel good or notice no diffrence, drop it. If you see a diffrence do it for as long as you want. You do not need high GI carbs or super formulas. The initial tests were done with creatine and tea, some were done with creatine and grape juice. I throw it in my pre-workout coffee.
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