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Old 02-21-2005, 05:10 PM   #1
Nicole Carroll
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This thread relates back to Paul's Nutrition Experiment.

Josh is publicly going on the Zone by keeping a food diary here. The original purpose of this thread relates back to Paul's difficulty with the WOD's. Coach Glassman suggested poor nutriton may be the problem so we started an experiment to see if changing Paul's diet would help his performance. For personal reasons Paul decided not to do it. Josh asked to be a substitue test subject, and here we are...
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Old 02-21-2005, 07:11 PM   #2
Eugene R. Allen
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This is copied over from the thread about Paul's Nutrition Experiment.

Nicole - We met at the seminar and we spoke a bit about your diet. I am 49, 5' 11" and 172 lbs. My Tanita scale says my bodyfat is somewhere between 9.5% and 14% depending on the day. My weight fluctuates between 168 and 174 over a period of days and as the weight goes up the bodyfat goes down. Hydration maybe? I have high blood pressure and right now sitting here spilling my guts it is 150 over 100...a gift/curse from my father. He was also diabetic, had a couple strokes, a couple heart attacks, a 5-way bypass and gout. His dad and both brothers died of heart attacks. He lived to be 72 but only because of the wonders of medical science.

I swim 10 to 15,000 yards a week, run two or three times a week with one or two of those being on the stairs (a stadium bowl with 1200 steps) and I bike 3 times a week indoors on a spin trainer at the Y or on my Computrainer. I also do quite a collection of CFesque type workouts. At 5:30 this morning I did a workout that is a spinoff of Fight Gone Bad that I call Purgatory. As a warm up we (SWAT team stud Scott Brown and my wife Chandra joined me) did a variety of medicine ball throws, 3 minutes of jumprope, calesthenics from Core Performance, about 15 minutes worth of Coach Burgener's warm ups and jump drills, a variety of KB lifts, two trips each up my rope ladder and two 30 second static holds on the rings with 5 straight leg lifts during the hold. Then Purgatory:

500m row or .30 run
50 swings with 44 lb KB
100 flutter kicks
50 high box toe taps
50 Thai kicks to heavy bag

400 meter row or .27 run
40 single arm KB cleans with 35 lb KB (20 each arm)
40 squat jumps
40 pushups (10 rings, 10 push up handles, 20 with hands on floor)
40 incline situps

300 meter row or .24 run
30 snatch (15 each arm) with 35 lb KB
30 V sits
30 deck squats
30 medicine ball slams

200 meter row or .21 run
20 two hand clean and jerk with 35 lb KB
20 pullups
20 box jumps
20 twisting situps on floor

100 meter row or .18 run
10 see saw press with 44 lb KB
10 over/unders (jump over bench, crawl under)
10 4-way box jumps (jump on over, back on to left, back on to right, back on then back to the start is one rep
10 ab roller

Total time was 38:12. I've done Helen in 11 flat got 383 in FGB a couple days ago, 12k in 52 minutes and not a chance in hell with a muscle up. My third workout of the day comes at 1600 when some girls I train come over. Not sure what we'll do yet.

I started aiming toward the Zone as soon as I got back from the seminar but the food measuring thing has not made its way into my routine. I'm swagging so far but with enough accuracy for me to be peeing like that Soviet equine.

Coach and Lauren put me at 17 with 5 meal blocks and two 1 block snacks. Given the motivation to follow rules and examine results and to look more like you Nicole, I think I could be convinced to measure things. I want your deltoids...well, not like I want you to Fed Ex them to Washington, I just want mine to look like yours. Coach needs a poster made of you.

OK, so I've kissed up a bit and am a willing elderly but still shy of senile participant. May I throw my metabolism at your feet or do you have a sufficient test stable?

eug
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Old 02-21-2005, 09:05 PM   #3
Joshua Newman
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A whole thread named after me! I'm equal parts terrified and thrilled.

Before I jump in with the details of the first day, Nicole asked for some performance benchmarks. Max pullups (performed about two minutes ago on my door-frame bar, kipping like a madman) = 22. Max deadlift = 275#, though with form that left a bit to be desired (WOD 041223). Haven't tried Fran yet, but will sub it in later this week instead of one of the upcoming workouts to get a near-the-beginning benchmark.

That said, what I ate:

9:30am (4 blocks)
4 eggs (4p)
1.3 tsp olive oil (4f)
Herbes de Provence (-) [To season scrambled eggs]
Orange (2c)
2 cups Tomato (2c)
24oz water (-)
6oz decaf coffee, black (-)

This is pretty close to what I would have eaten normally, though I'd usually have only done three eggs rather than a whopping four, and apparently have been using more olive oil than I realized, as the 1.3tsp looked pretty skimpy when gracing the bottom of the pan.

12:30pm (4 blocks)
4oz top round steak (4p)
3 dill pickles (1c)
Zucchini (1c)
1/2 cup Tomato Sauce (1c) [Nuked with zucchini]
1/2 cup grapes (1c)
4g walnuts (4f)
12oz water (-)
8oz green tea (-)
Multi-vitamin (-)

Put the new food scale to use for this meal. Placing the walnuts on it, I felt a bit like a drug dealer, which, if food=drug, I guess I kind of am.

3:30pm (2 blocks)
3oz baked salmon (2p)
2 cups chopped red cabbage & radish (1c)
2/3tsp olive oil (2f)
Dash vinegar (-)
1/2 pear (1c)
24oz water (-)

Wow. 2 cups of cabbage is *a lot* more than I'd have fed myself without measuring it out. I had trouble making it through.

5:00 WOD
23:16 as prescribed.
The rowing felt great, the running pathetic. I ran the 200 and 400 back in junior high (before switching over to wrestling training year-round in high school), and I can picture my former track coach shaking his head if told him the poor, poor times I put up today on those 400's.

Also practiced handstands post-WOD. Given my rate of progress, it appears I'll have to compete on the 2012 rather than 2008 US olympic gymnastics team. ;)

7:00pm (4 blocks)
2 cups green salad w/ vinagrette (1c, 3f)
6oz. swordfish (4p)
1 cup spinach w/ 1/3 tbsp butter (1c, 1f)
1 cup steamed broccoli and cauliflower (1c)
4oz. wine (1c)

This was a business meal out, so I had to eyeball portions. I did, however, stow the block chart in my jacket pocket, and steal away to the bathroom to examine it, in order to figure out what portion sizes I was shooting for. Hopefully, as I accurately weigh and measure meals at home, I'll get better at eyeballing, as I end up eating out for work fairly often, and want to be able to hit as close to Zone proportions as possible when I do.

10:30pm (2 blocks)
3oz baked salmon (2p, the leftovers from the earlier snack)
1 pear (2c)
10 olives (2f)

I'll have to hit the grocery store tomorrow for more produce, as I'm burning through it at a pretty rapid clip.

All in all, I think I ate far more carbs than I would if left to my own devices, and perhaps less fat than I'd usually dole out. Also, a few more bathroom trips than usual, as my intestines puzzle through this new influx of fiber and more fiber.

I'm back in the office tomorrow, and while I'll likely end up brown-bagging it in the future, I'm curious to head downstairs to our local deli for the afternoon snack, to see if I can line up balanced choices on the days I don't have time to prepare food in advance.

That's pretty much it. As Robb's lobbying for Lights Out has left me feeling slightly guilty about the nocturnal life I lead when working from home, I'm going to bed after I post this up.

Any thoughts, from Nicole or others, much appreciated.
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Old 02-21-2005, 10:50 PM   #4
Nicole Carroll
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Josh, I love the block chart stowage and stealthy bathroom excursions. That's the spirit!

2 things:

Watch the quantities on the veggies (carbs). You're a little shy on some quantities. For example, the cabbage is 2.25 cups for one block (and radishes are 4 cups=1 block). Also, try 2 cups cooked broccoli = 1 block (other charts range from 1.25 cups all the way up to 3 cups, 2 seems a good average). Lettuce is about 6 cups=1 block. I know in Paleo eating there is less emphasis on quantity and more on quality. Taking the quality of what your eating, which is great, combined with strict zone quantities will yield the best results.

Also, when cooking with oil in the pan, not all the oil gets absorbed into the food. It's best to use as little oil as possible in cooking and add it to the food after it's cooked for accuracy. Or you can count only half of what is put in the pan .

These are small things but over time they make a difference.

Keep up the good work.
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Old 02-22-2005, 12:50 PM   #5
Nicole Carroll
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Eugene- Your quite the charmer!
I am hoping you have checked your personal e-mail. We can work privately. I am thinking one of these on the board may be enough for now.

My hope is that people will use Josh's experiment to inform their own experiments. I am ALWAYS happy to help, publicly or privately, with block assignments, questions, trouble shooting etc. And while keeping a food diary is important (IMO essential), I don't think keeping it online is necessary for success. What IS necessary is to try it, do it for real (see "for real" guidelines in first post of Paul's Nutrition Experiement), for at least 3 weeks. I can't say enough about how worthwhile it is.
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Old 02-22-2005, 08:22 PM   #6
David Wood
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Many thanks to both Josh and Nicole for doing this "out loud and in public" . . . very interesting (and a bit scary) to watch (FOUR cups of radishes?!).
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Old 02-22-2005, 09:32 PM   #7
Joshua Newman
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Woke up twice during the night (2:00am and 5:00am), exceedingly thirsty and in dire need of a bladder-relieving bathroom run. I think it may be due to the relatively large amount of before-bed protein (as compared to what I normally eat); hopefully, my body will start to adjust.

Also, on Nicole's sage advice, am trying to make sure I don't skimp carb portions. Transferred the block list onto a note in my Palm phone, so I'll be able to refer to it more surreptitiously on the fly.

9:00am (4 blocks)
3oz Salmon (2p)
4 egg whites, hard boiled (2p)
1 orange (2c)
2 cups tomato (2c)
5 olives (1f)
15g walnuts (3f)
12oz water
8 oz tea (Republic of Tea's Wild Berry Plum Green Tea, a new acquisition, is exceedingly good.)

I was somewhat heartened to see this thread (http://www.crossfit.com/discus/messages/23/7795.html) on Paleo carbs, as four blocks of vegetables turns out to be a fairly remarkably amount. I think I'll be trying out the soup and stir-fry ideas.

12:30pm [4 blocks]
4oz grilled steak, cold, sliced (4p)
4 macadamia nuts (4f)
1 cucumber, speared (1c)
1 cup zucchini, speared (1c)
2 plums (2c)
16oz water (-)
1 shot espresso (-) (crucial preceding this afternoon's meetings with lawyers and more lawyers)

Brown bag special!

4:30pm [2 blocks]
2oz turkey breast [2p]
1tbs guacamole [2f]
1 cup strawberries [1c]
1/2 cup pineapple [1c]

This was the result of a foraging trip to my local deli; the salad/prepared foods island apparently is a perfect snack-stocking spot. I overshot slightly in the purchasing, then trimmed down the portions with measuring cups/spoons I'd brought from home; my colleagues are further (and likely rightly) convinced I'm nuts.

6:00pm [4 blocks]
4oz canned tuna (4p)
2 2/3 cups sauteed spinach (2c)
2 tsp olive oil (4f) (1tsp to cook, plus 1 tsp added post-cooking; that's as close to 4f as I can fake, I think)
Garlic (-)
1 cup tomato (1c)
Orange (1c)
24oz water

10:00pm [2 blocks]
3oz shrimp (2p) (may have overshot slightly on this, but did my best to do backwards math from the portion numbers on the frozen shrimp bag)
6 almonds (2f) (may be mildly allergic to these)
2 cups broccoli (1c)
12 asparagus spears (1c)
12oz water (slightly less than yesterday, in an effort to prevent my bladder from waking me up)

Helpful note to those reading along at home rather than trying this out: two cups of broccoli plus twelve asparagus spears is a truly ungodly amount of food.

To that end, swung by the grocery store on my way home from work today, and (among other restocked items) picked up ingredients for a small pot of beef vegetable soup, currently simmering away. As I'm a huge soup fan, if it tastes as good as it currently smells, this could be a regular meal choice.

Related side question: they had pre-cut stew vegetables on super-sale, which is good, though the mix included rutabaga, which I can't for the life of me find on any Zone block lists online. As I don't think it's particularly Paleo, I doubt I'll be using it regularly, but I have slightly more than a cup of it in there, and want to make sure I count it. Any thoughts?

Also, as a general thought on these first two days: I'd always been dubious of the idea of a food log, though I can already see why it works. I'm considerably more aware of what I'm eating, when, and in what proportions than I would be if I were just faking it and trying to aim vaguely towards the Zone. As ever, it appears the folks at CrossFit HQ know what they're talking about!
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Old 02-23-2005, 08:37 AM   #8
Norma Loehr
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Josh,

Are you experiencing any hunger pains? I started the zone the same day you did (albeit at 11 blocks a day given my size) and have been very hungry. I have been using some similar foods as well (fish, nuts, berries, broccoli, spinach, guacamole, orange) so I was curious.

Regards,

Norma
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Old 02-23-2005, 08:50 AM   #9
Larry Lindenman
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Josh, great idea cutting and pasting from the Jounal into your PDA...how do you do it? (sorry for the off topic ? but I love the idea).
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Old 02-23-2005, 09:00 AM   #10
Joshua Newman
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Norma:

I'm finding I get hungry sooner after meals in the morning / early afternoon than I do in the evening, so I'm experimenting today with eating earlier meals slightly closer together, then expanding between-meal time slowly over the course of the day, with the largest space between dinner and the before-bed snack. I'll let you know how that works for me.

Also:

Put on an undershirt this morning, and found it markedly tighter around my arms. Tried another - same thing. From what (relatively little) I know about bodybuilders carb-depleting and then rapidly carbing up before competitions, I suspect this means my prior Paleo diet was glycogen-deficient, leaving my body to hoard up on the recent increased intake. Here's hoping this will translate to an improved WOD later today!
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