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Old 07-10-2010, 04:31 PM   #1
Omar Omar
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Regionals unfair?

I would agree with you in saying that whoever wins the competitions has good grounds to claim being one of the fittest men alive; however, I do think it just may have been a different person to win that title had the sectionals and the regional competitions been standardized across the world.

Although it may not be always possible or along the “varied”, “unknown, and unknowable” concepts of CrossFit to standardize competitions, I can argue that the athletes that qualified from Canada are not as fit as those that qualified from lots of other regionals.

We know that anyone who qualified from any regional must be crazy fit!

Unfortunately, Canada’s regional competition workouts were not heavy enough.

In every CF games so far the strength aspect of fitness seemed to be more important than endurance. The athletes who had more power, strength, and speed had a better advantage over the athletes who had more endurance.

I think that if Canada’s competitions were a bit heavier we may have had different people qualify and thus better athletes since the CF games will again be heavy.

I do not know for a fact but this may be the case with some other regionals?

This is only my personal opinion =)
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Old 07-10-2010, 05:56 PM   #2
Eric Montgomery
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Re: Regionals unfair?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omar Omar View Post
I would agree with you in saying that whoever wins the competitions has good grounds to claim being one of the fittest men alive; however, I do think it just may have been a different person to win that title had the sectionals and the regional competitions been standardized across the world.

Although it may not be always possible or along the “varied”, “unknown, and unknowable” concepts of CrossFit to standardize competitions, I can argue that the athletes that qualified from Canada are not as fit as those that qualified from lots of other regionals.

We know that anyone who qualified from any regional must be crazy fit!

Unfortunately, Canada’s regional competition workouts were not heavy enough.

In every CF games so far the strength aspect of fitness seemed to be more important than endurance. The athletes who had more power, strength, and speed had a better advantage over the athletes who had more endurance.

I think that if Canada’s competitions were a bit heavier we may have had different people qualify and thus better athletes since the CF games will again be heavy.

I do not know for a fact but this may be the case with some other regionals?

This is only my personal opinion =)
It's not reasonable to expect all regionals to be standardized. Different venues, equipment availabilities, differences in temperature and elevation creating variations in score from one region to another, can't do all regionals on the same date so you wouldn't want to give one regional an advantage by announcing all events at the same time, etc.

The Canada regional had 5 events, and in 2 of those it was a significant advantage to be strong--the snatch complex and the one that included heavy tire flips. Don't you think the competitors who had the biggest numbers on snatch, OHS, and deadlift probably came out on top in those events? The other events were a pretty good mix--a pure metcon (trail run), a mix of pullups and wallballs, and an event that was more skill and coordination-based (DUs and burpees). There's nothing that says every Regional has to include at least one 1RM-type event. The SW Regionals didn't have any pure strength events, but in several events it was clear that being stronger was an advantage, and the guys with bigger 1RMs on power cleans, jerks, and OHS tended to beat the guys who had smaller numbers on those lifts. If all you're interested in is pure strength, go compete in or watch strongman or powerlifting competitions. CF never claimed to be about strength and strength alone, but stronger is usually better just like being able to run faster or do more pullups is usually better.

2 of Canada's top 6 men were in the top 15 at the Games last year--DJ Wickham and Michael Fitzgerald. That's pretty indicative of the best people coming out on top, and that the winners are qualified. Who else from Canada has a legitimate claim to be within those 6? And if they do, why didn't they show it at the Regionals?

OPT did a majority of the programming for the Canada regionals. I think the man knows what he's doing.

You say the Games will be heavy again this year--any particular source for that?

In any CF competition, someone will complain about the programming, or judging, or scoring system, but I'd say most events do a pretty good job of identifying who's the most fit. The better athletes will beat the not-better athletes 98% of the time.

Last edited by Eric Montgomery : 07-10-2010 at 06:00 PM.
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Old 07-10-2010, 10:29 PM   #3
Stephen Flamm
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Re: Regionals unfair?

I'm not sure if there is a better test of athleticism, strength, power, etc. than the snatch. The Canada Regional snatch complex tested the ability of athletes to repeat technical movements with heavy loads, something that a 1RM deadlift does not test. I suspect that the athletes who made it out of Canada will out-perform the rest at Aromas, but we'll just have to wait a week and see.

As a side note, at the East Central Regional, more than a dozen athletes pulled over 500 lbs. in the 1RM deadlift event, and many of these very same athletes stuggled with 135 lb. full snatches in the final event. I doubt any of the Canada qualifiers who completed the complex at 200+ lbs. would have trouble with either.
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Old 07-11-2010, 12:21 AM   #4
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Regionals unfair?

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Originally Posted by Stephen Flamm View Post
As a side note, at the East Central Regional, more than a dozen athletes pulled over 500 lbs. in the 1RM deadlift event, and many of these very same athletes stuggled with 135 lb. full snatches in the final event. I doubt any of the Canada qualifiers who completed the complex at 200+ lbs. would have trouble with either.
Indeed. Is the OP seriously arguing that someone with a 200+ lb. snatch isn't "strong enough" to represent Canada in the Games?

We'll see what happens next week.

Katherine
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Old 07-13-2010, 09:39 AM   #5
Robert Keefe
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Re: Regionals unfair?

I think this years games is going to really test all aspects of fitness. There's so much they can do being at the Home Depot center this year. I can't wait
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Old 07-13-2010, 06:48 PM   #6
Lincoln Brigham
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Re: Regionals unfair?

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Unfortunately, Canada’s regional competition workouts were not heavy enough... the CF games will again be heavy.
Possibly. And if they are not? There's a chance that the Games won't be a Strongman-Lite competition. Then the Canadian regionals will be looking pretty smart.

You really can't test all aspects of fitness. Not all of them. Not equally. Not in one weekend. Not without killing people. It's not possible - logistically or physiologically. Accept the notion that there will be compromises. The winners will be determined, in large part, based on the choice of those compromises.
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Old 07-15-2010, 02:48 AM   #7
Nik Nichols
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Re: Regionals unfair?

If the Canada regionanls were to light(or any other comp for the games) wont the games weed them out if the games ae way heavier? Then it wont make a difference.

During this years comps from sectionals to regionals I saw alot of bad form that was allowed to count as good reps. Bad box jumps ect. I figure all this will be sorted out in the games.

Besides Crossfit isn't fare. It won't be fare, it cant be fare. How can a workout regardless of what it is be fare to a 165 lbs person and a 225lbs person at the same time?

I love crossfit, so don't get me wrong about saying it isn't fare. It is something we have to expect till, or if ever there are weight classes.
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Old 07-15-2010, 04:37 AM   #8
Jay Rhodes
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Re: Regionals unfair?

Having competed in the afformentioned regional, I thought the programming was brilliant. In fact better than most other regionals.

It showcased every aspect of fitness crossfit touches on.

It allowed for a smaller guy to do well (provided you can hit a heavy snatch complex and flip a heavy *** tire) and allowed for a big guy to do well (provided you can run 5k, do DU/burpees at lightning pace) which after all is what the programming SHOULD be doing.

It shouldn't be specialized to the big strong guys, or smaller faster guys. Nik is spot on, it will never be 100% fair. It can't be. But honestly these events were about as good as it gets IMO.


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Old 07-15-2010, 06:36 AM   #9
Nik Nichols
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Re: Regionals unfair?

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Don't complain, just get better.
Nailed it, I'm glad you posted up Jay. I did see your comp un fare but like I said there was some crap for let through, but it will all come out at the games.
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Old 07-15-2010, 11:56 AM   #10
Justin McCallon
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Re: Regionals unfair?

I didn't compete at the Canadian Regional.

I also have noticed that generally the top 1 or 2 guys are a good bit ahead of the pack and are going to qualify almost regardless of what test the Regional has.

That said, out of the four events at the Canada Regional, 3 favor little guys and one favors bigger guys. So yeah it is highly cardio-focused. In three of the events, strength is close to a non-issue. And, the one strength event is Snatch, which is probably the best lift for little dudes to be competitive at since it's so technical.

OPT seems like a smart dude and all, but I think he biased the event horribly toward the little cardio dudes.
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