CrossFit Discussion Board  

Go Back   CrossFit Discussion Board > CrossFit Forum > Fitness
CrossFit Home Forum Site Rules CrossFit FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-05-2009, 12:41 PM   #1
Eric Peterson
Member Eric Peterson is offline
 
Eric Peterson's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Seattle  WA
Posts: 8
When to scale?

So i've been crossfitting for a bit now, and usually just do the WODs as rx.

However, every now and then a WOD comes up and it takes me over 30 min to finish. While I certainly file this under the variation theme of xfit, part of me wonders if I am out of the metcon range with times like that. In fact, an xfit trainer once told me when I was beginning that if the WODs were taking me 30-40 min I should be scaling.

Any thoughts? Just finished today's WOD and like many 5 rounders I wondered if I would have gotten more out of it by scaling and really sprinting through it, rather than as rx in 30+ min.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 12:52 PM   #2
Brian Bedell
Member Brian Bedell is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lantana  FL
Posts: 2,870
Re: When to scale?

Obviously, it depends on the WOD. I would take a look at the comments, or logsitall, and see how others are doing. Like you mention, some WOD's are meant to be long, and over 30 minutes. You don't complete the 10K in 30mins do you??

"Every now and then," a WOD takes all of us over 30mins. Barbara, 10K, F50, etc. If you are way out of the time ranges, scale it. Then there is a whole other debate on whether you should scale the weight or reps. Search that.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 12:58 PM   #3
Steven Low
Member Steven Low is offline
 
Steven Low's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: silver spring  maryland
Posts: 12,221
Re: When to scale?

One of the more interesting ways to get the same metabolic effect as the "firebreathers" is to look at their times and then scale the workout to the point that you're hitting the same times as them.

Of course, if you need strength, it may be better to just scale the workout a little. Or you could add a couple supplementary strength lifts here and there.

It's really up to you and depends on what your goals are... CF for sport, fitness your goal, or whatever else you want to do.
__________________
Posts are NOT medical, training, nutrition info
Bodyweight Article, Overcoming Gravity Book
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 01:14 PM   #4
Scott Allen Hanson
Member Scott Allen Hanson is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Idaho Falls  Idaho
Posts: 1,008
Re: When to scale?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Peterson View Post
So i've been CrossFitting for a bit now, and usually just do the WODs as rx.

However, every now and then a WOD comes up and it takes me over 30 min to finish. While I certainly file this under the variation theme of xfit, part of me wonders if I am out of the metcon range with times like that. In fact, an xfit trainer once told me when I was beginning that if the WODs were taking me 30-40 min I should be scaling.

Any thoughts? Just finished today's WOD and like many 5 rounders I wondered if I would have gotten more out of it by scaling and really sprinting through it, rather than as rx in 30+ min.

They're not all supposed to be sprints. Many will take the average CF'er 30 minutes or more (10K run, Linda, Kelly, Murph, Eva). Today's is a long one. Whether its 20 minutes or 35 minutes, the metabolic pathway break-down is going to be the same (unless you sprint through individual rounds and take long recoveries). My personal criterion is that if I can do it as rx'd, I do, unless its going to take an inordinate amount of time relative to the average. This provides easy comparisons for future WOD's.

You can give yourself a different stimulus on the same workout by scaling or partitioning, and neither is necessarily "right" for everyone. For example, lets say your rx'd Fran is 10 minutes. You could scale to 65# and do it in 6:00. You could do the rx'd weight for fewer reps (eg, 15, 12, 9). You could partition into intervals to train yourself to go all out (i.e., do the 21's full bore, rest several minutes, then do the 15's, rest, then 9's).

For GPP, you don't necessarily want to be only good at WOD's that take 20 minutes or less. Sooner or later, you'll need a longer effort.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 06:13 PM   #5
Tate Rivera
Member Tate Rivera is offline
 
Tate Rivera's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Cookeville  TN
Posts: 365
Re: When to scale?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Allen Hanson View Post
You could partition into intervals to train yourself to go all out (i.e., do the 21's full bore, rest several minutes, then do the 15's, rest, then 9's).
Is this just a practice type of thing you are suggesting, or subbing this for an actual WOD? If you are suggesting this as a WOD then you are missing out on one of the most important factors: intensity.

This also relates to the OP. One thing to consider is your intensity level. For example, I did some weighted pull ups and dips the other day with 35 lbs and it took me 15 minutes. On the pull ups I was basically doing sets of heavy singles. If I would (and should) have scaled down, then I would have finished faster and kept my intensity level higher. So if you find yourself going real slow and resting more than you are working, then you might need to scale. Intensity is one of the key things that separates CrossFit. Coach talks about this in Part 4 of the War College talks. I hope this makes sense.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 06:59 PM   #6
Marcus Allen
Member Marcus Allen is offline
 
Marcus Allen's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Grants Pass  OR
Posts: 1,675
Re: When to scale?

Were the weighted pull ups close to a ME for you? They would be for me, so doing say 7x1 with a couple minutes rest easily takes 15 minutes.

I am just now getting to do many WODs as RxD, and my times are slow. I feel that I go with the most intensity that I can for the duration. My untrained brain says this will get my body used to pushing harder for longer.

I don't know much about the metabolic pathways and I want to train as efficiently as I can for my end goal of 185# and 1000 CFT.

So at what point do I lose the MetCon benfits, and what am I doing to myself after that?
__________________
My Log, CFKids Certified
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 07:18 PM   #7
Joe Bernard
Member Joe Bernard is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Philadelphia  PA
Posts: 2,626
Re: When to scale?

There's no set point, per se, but it's just when you are doing 1-2 reps of an exercise and then waiting around for a couple minutes to try it again. Then it becomes more of a strength workout than metcon. I still can't do the heavier weighted WODs as Rx'd and scale them. The measure I use for all of them (especially if it's a WOD with a 21-15-9 rep scheme) is that I pick a weight where I can do 4-5 reps in a row. It challenges my strength moreso than scaling it solely for intensity purposes and I like doing it this way. Doing 1 rep then resting defeats the purpose of a metcon.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 10:23 PM   #8
Matthew Mills
Member Matthew Mills is offline
 
Matthew Mills's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Coarsegold  Ca.
Posts: 168
Re: When to scale?

I think part of this mental game starts when you get to a point that you don't have to scale anymore. Then along comes a wod that doses you with reality. That's where I am at right now. I get my butt handed to me more often than I'd like, but I'll be damned if I'm going to drop weight now! I don't care if it takes me all damn day!
__________________
http://www.crossfitftf.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2009, 10:58 PM   #9
Scott Allen Hanson
Member Scott Allen Hanson is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Idaho Falls  Idaho
Posts: 1,008
Re: When to scale?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tate Rivera View Post
Is this just a practice type of thing you are suggesting, or subbing this for an actual WOD? If you are suggesting this as a WOD then you are missing out on one of the most important factors: intensity.
Its not called HIIT for nothing. Just a different angle that may help you increase intensity. If you can't do Fran/Elizabeth/Diane unbroken, you can partition it to an interval WO and complete segments at higher intensity than you otherwise could. I'm not suggesting that this is the same workout, but may be a path to help you get to an unbroken, higher intensity Fran, etc.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2009, 05:46 AM   #10
Tate Rivera
Member Tate Rivera is offline
 
Tate Rivera's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Cookeville  TN
Posts: 365
Re: When to scale?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Allen View Post
Were the weighted pull ups close to a ME for you? They would be for me, so doing say 7x1 with a couple minutes rest easily takes 15 minutes.

I am just now getting to do many WODs as RxD, and my times are slow. I feel that I go with the most intensity that I can for the duration. My untrained brain says this will get my body used to pushing harder for longer.

I don't know much about the metabolic pathways and I want to train as efficiently as I can for my end goal of 185# and 1000 CFT.

So at what point do I lose the MetCon benfits, and what am I doing to myself after that?
The weight was not close to my ME. I have pulled 75lbs before (although it was a while ago) and this was 35lbs. Here, for example, my heart was not pounding and it was not working me metabolically. I was having to wait too long between sets.

I don't think there is a specific amount of time that defines "too long", but I could just tell that it was very slow going.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What to scale? Jake Galgon Starting 9 05-08-2008 07:11 PM
To scale or not to scale Júlíus Magnússon Starting 3 02-07-2008 03:09 PM
Should I scale down? Jeff Wendt Starting 5 01-07-2008 07:59 AM
Barbara to scale or not to scale? Barry Herman Workout of the Day 1 12-27-2007 08:55 AM
To Scale or Not to Scale? Brandon Roth Fitness 7 10-13-2007 12:13 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:24 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
CrossFit is a registered trademark of CrossFit Inc.