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Old 11-30-2007, 09:15 AM   #21
Carlo Mattia
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

ladies and gentlemen one simple question why do we train/study martial arts ? to learn how to fight ? or so we do not have to fight (avoid the situation)
listen awareness is certianly the first step, secondly now a days you have to cross train in diffrent arts to truly be able to defend yourself the first UFC's proved the very same thing, then it evolved into a sport MMA taking what works best from several arts, hence the term arts most styles are based in tradition and their techniques have long since become almost obsolite yes they are still functional but the chances of a traditional karate stylest landing a reverse punch on a trained western boxer is next to none. and that same boxer being taken to the ground by a sombo or BJJ practicioner is certian doom
so back to the first question self defense being able to defend yourself against who? everyone? fat chance someone will always be able to whip you!
the same way crossfit gives you the best bang for your buck so does MMA
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Old 11-30-2007, 09:42 AM   #22
Darren Zega
 
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

If you buy into these sorts of things, and I'm a tool who does:

"The ultimate aim of the art of Karate lies not in victory or defeat, but in the perfection of the characters of its participants."
- Gichin Funakoshi

I think all forms of martial arts and martial sport like MMA - and really any practiced skill for that matter - at their highest levels all blend together in this regard. Karate practicioners, like me, just tend to be a bit nerdier than most as we like to put quotes like this up in our pratice areas to make ourselves feel cooler.

Last edited by Darren Zega : 11-30-2007 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 11-30-2007, 02:01 PM   #23
Jake A Shannon
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

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There are more recorded assaults using blunt objects than body parts in the USA.
Awesome link, thanks!
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Old 11-30-2007, 03:32 PM   #24
Steve Vanderbok
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

My random comments on this thread:

Becca eloquently hit the nail on the head.

For those of you who've been watching Human Weapon on THC, do you recall the Krav Maga episode? The salty old Isreali commando told Jason Chambers that he might be a great ring fighter but had no concept of self-defense. That said after he'd fileted him with a rubber knife. MMA != Reality. However, it sure as heck is a giant leg up on the untrained! And it's a short step from there to learning/understanding unarmed combat.

Whatever art you are studying will likely have some completely useless fluff. Keep your eyes open for it. To paraphrase Bruce Lee, take what's useful and discard the rest. Think of yourself as a martial artist, not a JKD and BJJ (or whatever your alphabet soup is) person.

Be honest with yourself as well. If your goal is to be a part of the (insert art here) tradition, culture and experience then please continue with it. But don't let yourself be deluded by your black belt into thinking you're an unbeatable fighter. I've seen Karate masters humbled by BJJ white belts. I've seen a TKD black belt get the snot beat out of him by an untrained guy from the barrio. We've probably all seen black belt "experts" get tooled. Street fights are not constrained by rules, forms, katas, etc. Nor do all attackers act in an orthodox fasion. To paraphrase Bruce again, combat is like a pound of water wrapped in a paper bag. The only thing you can be sure of it's gonna be messy. So train smart and know what you're training for.
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Old 11-30-2007, 05:40 PM   #25
Randall Scott
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Becca Borawski View Post
I'm not ever going to thai kick somebody in a self-defense situation. For most people, and women especially that would be unrealistic and inappropriate. I tried it once when I was drunk and ****ed at somebody in Vegas and let me tell you -- it doesn't work so well in high heels.

And while that's funny - it gets to the point that it's not terribly realistic. Nor is it terribly realistic to think I'm going to armbar or RNC a guy trying to rape me. While that knowledge might help me at some point in my life, it shouldn't be what I'm relying on for self defense.



Agreed - that's great knowledge for kids to have!

much of what you are doing is picking and choosing different things from mma that may not be as effective in a street fight to try to make your point. most of the time muay thai kicks would not be a great idea but i'll take the plum clinch, knees, and elbows for a street fight/self defense situation any day. same goes for grappling/wrestling/bjj. no an arm bar is not a great move for street situations, however, the control from wrestling is, as well as many bjj moves such as guillitines, wrist control, and yes rear naked chokes which are one of the more common bjj moves used in street situations. want to talk about rape defense? get really good at triangles. not saying it is going to save you 100% of the time, but it sure can/could be effective against someone in the missionary ie guard position!
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Old 12-03-2007, 08:14 AM   #26
Roelant Bergen
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

Damn.....beat me to it.....although triangle while the dude's trying to rape you??? wow....that's still pretty technical to me though. I'm all for the RNC, wrist control, and yes, I couldn't agree with you more, wrestling. And I have used the plum clinch with knees before, it wasn't textbook or pretty, but I got to run away and live to fight another day.....
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Old 12-03-2007, 04:42 PM   #27
Rob Sheldon
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

For self defense, why not good ol' fashioned boxing? Read Beaumont's Championship Streetfighting: Boxing as a Martial Art, practice the moves, get a sparring partner and go whoop some bad guys butt!
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Old 12-03-2007, 06:29 PM   #28
David Bott
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

Rob: there is nothing wrong with boxing at all. However, many poeple feel that alot of fights end up on the ground, inwhich case boxing may not be of the greatest efficacy... hence the choices of BJJ etc.

Becca: I guess going by your definition of sparring I think the style of JJ I do does incorporate that into our training. We will spend time where we have someone attack in a non-preset manner at a realistic speed. This is not done at all levels of training of course, as lower grades simply lack the necessary control to avoid hurting each other
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Old 12-03-2007, 06:36 PM   #29
David Bott
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall Scott View Post
much of what you are doing is picking and choosing different things from mma that may not be as effective in a street fight to try to make your point. most of the time muay thai kicks would not be a great idea but i'll take the plum clinch, knees, and elbows for a street fight/self defense situation any day. same goes for grappling/wrestling/bjj. no an arm bar is not a great move for street situations, however, the control from wrestling is, as well as many bjj moves such as guillitines, wrist control, and yes rear naked chokes which are one of the more common bjj moves used in street situations. want to talk about rape defense? get really good at triangles. not saying it is going to save you 100% of the time, but it sure can/could be effective against someone in the missionary ie guard position!
Why is an armbar not a great "street" defense? If it's given to you, why not take it and break the arm?? Isn't is mostly contextual? If you know how to give a good Muai Thai kick and the opportunity is there, why not use it? If a finger lock is available, a strangle, eye poke, throat punch, large convoluted highly stylised ground control, a rediculous variation of a lock using your forehead as the lever.... if they are there, use them.
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Old 12-03-2007, 10:03 PM   #30
Randall Scott
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Re: Why MMA/KM?

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Originally Posted by Roelant Bergen View Post
Damn.....beat me to it.....although triangle while the dude's trying to rape you??? wow....that's still pretty technical to me though. I'm all for the RNC, wrist control, and yes, I couldn't agree with you more, wrestling. And I have used the plum clinch with knees before, it wasn't textbook or pretty, but I got to run away and live to fight another day.....

the reason i say that about the triangle is.........in both jits as well as mma, if someone has a good triangle it is hard to stay out of it even if you know it is coming. for that reason alone i feel that it can be a great move to stop an attacker who is trying to rape the woman. if she were to lock it in i think the biggest worry would be the guy powering out,or slamming her. it all would come down to strength, size difference, and technique. 100% effective? not even close....a good option for the righ situation? totally!

also...with what you are saying about the clinch, etc.....my exact point! even a sloppy clinch, knees, etc. are far beyond what most people know, expect, or can handle in a street situation.
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