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Old 06-01-2009, 10:56 PM   #1
Philip Bjorge
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PR Squat at 250

Hi everyone,
A few more workouts into Starting Strength and I'm at 250.

I've included a video and an image of me at the bottom of each rep. This is my 3rd set and definitely the hardest haha.

http://img190.imageshack.us/my.php?image=squat2502.mp4 (Video)(WFS)

http://i39.tinypic.com/14c6ypf.jpg (WFS)

So it looks like I'm JUST at parallel so I'll attemp to squeeze and extra half inch or so - I get worried about getting stuck. This is correct right?

How else does everything else look? Should I move on to 255?
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:54 AM   #2
Greg Pieris
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Re: PR Squat at 250

Number 2 and 5 are *just* parallel, the rest are high.

They need to be deeper, but this is partly because you're also dropping your chest/leaning forward a bit, which takes the hamstrings out of the movement.

If you're sitting back on your heels, rather than dropping forward, drawing a line vertically down from the centre of the barbell should line up with the middle of your feet. You can see from the photos that you are sitting back more reps 2 and 5, in particular number 2, which is almost spot on. The rest, you are dropping forward a bit. The bar's going lower, but your hips aren't. That's why you're not hitting depth. It will also be hitting your quads and glutes, without much contribution from your hamstrings.

If you keep your chest up and sit back on your heels like in number 2, then try to get your knees out more, you'll hit depth and you'll bring more hamstring into the movement.

It'd drop back around 10% and fix that. You'll find 255 a lot easier once it's fixed, and it'll be deeper too.

In the ascent, in all the reps, the bar is shifting forward. That's probably just because it's heavy. Your spotter should be yelling at you to keep your chest up when this happens.

Otherwise, I reckon they're not bad.

Last edited by Greg Pieris; 06-02-2009 at 01:00 AM..
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:27 AM   #3
Steven Webster
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Re: PR Squat at 250

I think you should deliberately attempt TO get stuck. If you make it then your confident will grow. If you don't make it, take some weight off. At some point I just wanted to get the reps but I would avoid doing it properly just to make the numbers. So I would get a rep out of the way to do the next, and get that rep out of the way for the next and so on, thus avoiding tackling each one.

What happens is allowing other muscles to take over the workload or using leverage instead of creating all the appropriate tensions. If you avoid the tension that ultimately lets you down it doesn't get resolved and the result is your reps get crappier and crappier, just because you know in the back of your mind you'll get stuck and you would rather avoid that just to tell yourself you're stronger.

So, take the full brunt of the weight, never avoid it. Make it hard as can be and eventually those weak points will handle it. Never again will you wuss out of a rep because the aim is to get stronger, lifting more weight does not always mean you are stronger when you avoid hard reps.

BTW, I don't think you're going to get much lower without losing tightness in the back, so stretch. Possibly a shade lower with some stretching, but otherwise good.
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Old 06-02-2009, 10:05 AM   #4
Philip Bjorge
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Re: PR Squat at 250

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Pieris View Post
If you keep your chest up and sit back on your heels like in number 2, then try to get your knees out more, you'll hit depth and you'll bring more hamstring into the movement.
I definitely see that in number 2 the bar is in basically the right place over the midfoot and the others are a bit off (Such a small amount but it makes a difference haha).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Webster View Post
I think you should deliberately attempt TO get stuck. If you make it then your confident will grow. If you don't make it, take some weight off. At some point I just wanted to get the reps but I would avoid doing it properly just to make the numbers. So I would get a rep out of the way to do the next, and get that rep out of the way for the next and so on, thus avoiding tackling each one.

What happens is allowing other muscles to take over the workload or using leverage instead of creating all the appropriate tensions. If you avoid the tension that ultimately lets you down it doesn't get resolved and the result is your reps get crappier and crappier, just because you know in the back of your mind you'll get stuck and you would rather avoid that just to tell yourself you're stronger.

So, take the full brunt of the weight, never avoid it. Make it hard as can be and eventually those weak points will handle it. Never again will you wuss out of a rep because the aim is to get stronger, lifting more weight does not always mean you are stronger when you avoid hard reps.

BTW, I don't think you're going to get much lower without losing tightness in the back, so stretch. Possibly a shade lower with some stretching, but otherwise good.
I'm sorry but this post isn't quite making sense to me? Are you telling me to keep going or to reset?
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:19 AM   #5
Graeme Howland
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Re: PR Squat at 250

Definitely agree with Greg's post, focus on chest up and sitting back to get your hips lower without leaning forward more. Also knees out versus forward as much as possible helps with depth.

Regarding failing, you need to fail at some point. Practice failing a rep with just the bar, then with 135, 185, 225. You need to be comfortable with the idea and feel of getting stuck in the hole and having to leave the weight on the safety bars. When I was doing SS I was hesitant to fail, sometimes I would rack after 3 or 4 reps rather than fail because I was worried it was going to hurt or be loud or something. It's not a big deal at all, and once you are used to it you will be more confident in just going for it (with good form) knowing that if you don't get it nothing bad is going to happen.
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Old 06-07-2009, 04:19 PM   #6
Philip Bjorge
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Re: PR Squat at 250

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Pieris View Post
Number 2 and 5 are *just* parallel, the rest are high.

They need to be deeper, but this is partly because you're also dropping your chest/leaning forward a bit, which takes the hamstrings out of the movement.

If you're sitting back on your heels, rather than dropping forward, drawing a line vertically down from the centre of the barbell should line up with the middle of your feet. You can see from the photos that you are sitting back more reps 2 and 5, in particular number 2, which is almost spot on. The rest, you are dropping forward a bit. The bar's going lower, but your hips aren't. That's why you're not hitting depth. It will also be hitting your quads and glutes, without much contribution from your hamstrings.

If you keep your chest up and sit back on your heels like in number 2, then try to get your knees out more, you'll hit depth and you'll bring more hamstring into the movement.

It'd drop back around 10% and fix that. You'll find 255 a lot easier once it's fixed, and it'll be deeper too.

In the ascent, in all the reps, the bar is shifting forward. That's probably just because it's heavy. Your spotter should be yelling at you to keep your chest up when this happens.

Otherwise, I reckon they're not bad.
Hey everyone, I popped down to 225 and I am still doing the exact same thing as before. Are their any other cues I can work on to try and hit depth? I just can't seem to get it!
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Old 06-07-2009, 07:14 PM   #7
Lou Cabales
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Re: PR Squat at 250

drop weight some more , try a@* to grass or at least past current comfort zone and get stuck. you dont know till YOu try!, your in a cage. youll be amazed when YOu hit stretch reflex.

try thirdworld squat with squat stretch

id like to see front view to see squat stance width.

Last edited by Lynne Pitts; 06-09-2009 at 01:14 PM.. Reason: no AOL-speak, strike 3
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Old 06-10-2009, 08:48 AM   #8
Kevin Thomas
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Re: PR Squat at 250

You shouldn't have to drop weight to hit depth. Are you hitting depth in your warmups? BTW, the video you posted isn't that bad. A little high in some cases, but not something you shouldn't be able to work through. I'd keep adding weight. I'd be a little more worried about the bar coming forward on your assent than the depth issue. That has a greater chance of messing up your back. Again, it's not that bad and you should be able to work through it.

Also, Since you are doing SS, you should be aware that Rip isn't a fan of using light weight to focus on form. He seems to be a fan of yelling instead. Below is one of his less colorful comments on the subject. As long as you are not hurting yourself, there is no reason to avoid getting stronger to instead focus on form.

"I have never written a program for anybody that has the weight stay the same while a movement is learned. You learn the movement, work up to a weight that seems reasonable for your level of expertise, and then you go up a little THE NEXT WORKOUT. There is no point in a novice remaining at any weight for more than one workout, because the same weight will no more guarantee a technique improvement than a small jump will prevent it, and if you don't go up you're not getting stronger." -Rip

http://************.net/forum/showthread.php?t=5189 (Site Not WFS)
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