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Old 08-03-2005, 08:42 AM   #21
Alexander Karatis
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Eugene,

Excellent points. With regard to my last sentence, it was intentionally written with that contradiction you pointed out.

I could've written that CF is for everyone. Which is false. Or that CF is not for everyone. Which is true.

The particular way I phrased it was intending to strike home the key point that motivation and honesty are enough to lift a sedentary, lazy person off their fat *** and allow them to "join" the community. That's all it takes to be a CFer in my book, intense effort.

I may be missing a few, but these two attributes are a big step toward allowing a person to participate, and hence, be a part of this community.

As far as attitude is concerned, I too am of the opinion that any amount of it should follow accomplishment, but it is especially then that its absence constitutes greatness.

If we plotted the phsych profiles of those of us who frequent the board or participate in the community more often, it is very likely that we would display many similiarities that the majority of people may not associate themselves with.

I just wanted to warn against mistaking ourselves as "elite". The goal is to reach elite athleticism which some have already reached. And amazingly enough, in the CF world, the level of fitness attained is inversely proportional to the level of "attitude" displayed-which is another reason this place rocks so hard!
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Old 08-03-2005, 09:04 AM   #22
mark twight
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IMO life would be fairly boring without the constant tension (conflict even) between egalitarianism and elitism. Embrace it.

"In Defense of Elitism" by William A. Henry III

One of the best books I have ever read


Mark T.
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Old 08-03-2005, 09:22 AM   #23
David Werner
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I really like Alexanders' "Platonic ideal" approach to the concept that is Crossfit. I strive toward a goal I'll never reach, not because of a lack of progress, but because the bar is set so high.

As far as what the moderators want on the board - we want a reasonable signal to noise ratio.

The goal here is to have a TRAINING forum. If every funny man gets in a snide comment regularly we will not be able to wade through it all to read the training questions and answers. My personal opinion is that the internet is a poor place to get to know people. I try not to burden the conversation here with my personality, and I don't really believe the personalities that are shown on the net. Meeting people in person with whom you've conversed on the net is fascinating - it's rarely what you expect.

None of the moderators is interested in dictating conversation or running people off, but we do get weary of those few people who insist on being the center of attention all the time.

I want to hear the questions and observations of anyone trying to make Crossfit work for them. I really don't care about having my cultural trivia knowledge tested.

Working out, fitness, health and Crossfit are somewhat obsesive subjects for me, and I think for all the other moderators. That's why were here.

Dave Werner
Crossfit North
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Old 08-03-2005, 09:49 AM   #24
Ron Nelson
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Dave,
Thanks for the most insightful post yet on this thread. I think we all now realize what the mods are thinking and why.

and with that, I'm out.
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Old 08-03-2005, 11:07 AM   #25
Jim Aldridge
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I will have to agree with Alexander that elitism was not the best choice of terms where the description of attitude is concerned. And Eugene is right when he says it is a term best applied to accomplishment. I'm sorry for the confusion that I caused. (There is a reason i sling an axe for a living and don't write speeches for the president). I really wasn't trying to defend snobbishness, especially since I have nothing to be snobbish about (I am nowhere even NEAR the athlete that most of you are). Indeed, it is the humility and the willingness to help on the part of many of the truly "elite" athletes here that make crossfit so unique. My point was simply that the kind of people who do crossfit are often very "intense" individuals and with that comes some added benefits/baggage sometimes. But generally, in my experience, the association with those people is worth the quirks and baggage.

Once again, I respect the job that the moderators do here. I don't envy them in the least. As I stated, there is probably much more to the "dilemma" than I know, and I may well have spoken out of place by "weighing in" on the issue. If so, I apologize.

Jim
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Old 08-03-2005, 01:57 PM   #26
Tom Shook
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Train hard and worry about the man (or lady) in the mirror...everything else will take care of itself.
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Old 08-04-2005, 05:21 AM   #27
Alexander Karatis
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Dave, great post. Puts a lot of things in perspective.:happy:
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Old 08-04-2005, 08:19 AM   #28
John Walsh
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This has been some good discussion. The moderators and all other participants in running this site have done a great job. I have been running my own site for 5 year, not fitness related, and know it can be a grind staying on course. I respect the fact that I am a guest on this site and try to play within the rules. I run my site as a benevolent dictator. I have over a dozen writers and have edited maybe two pieces over 5 years. However I reserve the right to do whatever I want on my site and I don’t have to answer for anything I do. I do however keep in mind that without an audience and participants I have no reason for existence.

There are only a handful of things that will force me to draw the line. I find that most ideas and discussions that are BS tend to just fizzle out on their own accord. If I were a moderator on this site I would keep the discussion pretty tight in all areas but Community. Which is what I think our moderators do. That’s the catchall and sometimes good stuff comes from that kind of brainstorming. Most of the time it’s just crap but that’s fine.

I think all this discussion started when Dan Silver volunteered to stop posting on the discussion board. After thinking about it it’s not really about Dan, or me or anyone else for that matter. It’s about what’s appropriate and what’s not on the discussion board. Personal insults, attacks, overly political or religious topics seem clearly inappropriate and for the most part these are areas that are rarely breached which is a credit to the CF posters. Inside jokes, trivia, ballyhoo, and tomfoolery can be grey areas. It’s like this. I don’t need to go into the Starting section and respond to a new guys question with some smart Alec comment or “amusing” anecdote. I either comment straight forward or I keep my mouth shut. The same goes for every other category except Community. Here, at least it’s my perception; we have more leeway to express ourselves.

This is the freestyle area. Discussions should still apply to fitness but in a less restrictive format. This, to me, is the section for debate, sparing and exploration. Sometimes it’s just amusement or down right worthless but how do you know until you have hashed your idea around a bit? I have been in the writing game for a long time as a sideline. It’s been suggested here and other places that you should keep your personality out of your writing. I’ve never understood this. I quit a writing gig over this once. Writing is a reflection of your thoughts, which are a reflection of your personality. How does one do this on topics such as “Henry Rollins’ Thoughts”? I mean it’s not a technical manual. Humor is a form of communication. So is sarcasm. There is nothing wrong with it until it becomes personal or someone takes it personal. Discerning this is where the challenge lies.

So having said all this, and fully cognizant of the fact that it’s unsolicited, here are my suggestions to the moderators and posters.

Moderators: Keep doing what you’re doing. Keep the Comminuty section loose but within certain parameters. Ask yourself if what you are reading is really offensive or is it something that you just don’t get. I found that my best writers were guys that I just didn’t get at first. Later I recognized their brilliance.

Posters: Don’t get cute in the non-Community sections. If someone has a direct question about pull-ups, answer it. Don’t quote lyrics to your favorite songs. Save that for the Community section and entitle the subject, “Lyrics to may favorite songs”. I am as guilty as sin of being impressed with my own witticisms and will make a concentrated effort to curb them to the Community section and I hope that the moderators will be judicious in allowing some leeway in the Community section.

Cheers!

PS Where's Larry Lindenman when you need him?:wink:








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