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Old 05-23-2012, 09:37 AM   #101
Michael Dowling
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Re: TRT experience

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Originally Posted by Bob Herald View Post
Yep, and I never really put together what was going on with me before. What's the difference between the 19 yo who can eat Doritos, looks ripped , and can train every day vs me?? Testosterone is the only answer
I think if every 35 year old mans expectation is to feel and be able to train like he were 19 every single 35 year old would need TRT. We get old, cutting back training volume and dealing with extended recovery is part of it. The expectation to have the sex drive and recovery of a 19 year old at 35 is totally unrealistic.

Before anyone takes a leap with TRT realize once you do you basically have to be on it for life. Your body that was once producing test on the low range of normal probably produces little to none on its own after TRT. If you ever move to insurance that won't cover it or lose insurance altogether you will crash and burn and suffer serious sides. TRT is just steroids really so you have to deal with all the side effects of steroids too which can be pretty bad like man boobs, balding, shrinking nads, mood swings etc...

There's a place for TRT definitely if you are legitimately producing low test and haven't lost that gut, cut back on alcohol, upped foods which can boost test, lifted heavy etc...
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:14 PM   #102
Charley Agen
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Re: TRT experience

Good to hear Bob! Keep us posted. I'll let you know what my test results are as well when I get them.
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Old 05-24-2012, 05:42 PM   #103
Bob Herald
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Exclamation Re: TRT experience

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Originally Posted by Michael Dowling View Post
I think if every 35 year old mans expectation is to feel and be able to train like he were 19 every single 35 year old would need TRT. We get old, cutting back training volume and dealing with extended recovery is part of it. The expectation to have the sex drive and recovery of a 19 year old at 35 is totally unrealistic.

Before anyone takes a leap with TRT realize once you do you basically have to be on it for life. Your body that was once producing test on the low range of normal probably produces little to none on its own after TRT. If you ever move to insurance that won't cover it or lose insurance altogether you will crash and burn and suffer serious sides. TRT is just steroids really so you have to deal with all the side effects of steroids too which can be pretty bad like man boobs, balding, shrinking nads, mood swings etc...

There's a place for TRT definitely if you are legitimately producing low test and haven't lost that gut, cut back on alcohol, upped foods which can boost test, lifted heavy etc...
I was blood tested by a urologist and an endocrinologist, and my levels are low even for a 35 yo man. A 35 yo should be around 600. I was around 400. To say it can be controlled by diet and lifestyle completely, is ignorant. I have about 2 alcoholic drinks a month, eat and sleep well, and don't take any drugs. It's not about feeling like a 19 year old, it's about feeling like a man and a normal 35 year old.

TRT doesn't carry the same risks or rewards as testosterone at anabolic doses. It is dose dependent. Meaning that if you supplement at super physiological levels, you will experience those side effects. At a normal dose , those side effects are nonexistent.

There is a lot of misunderstanding that TRT is performance enhancing and carries the same side effects at doses used for performance enhancement . TRT has resulted in some muscle mass gain for me, but the muscle I have gained is what a "normal" guy would gain with my eating, sleeping, and training regimen.

If you were a man with low testosterone. You would "get it". A host of problems stem from a mans testosterone being low, such as increased cardiovascular risk and increased cancer risk. Testosterone has been demonized by its abuse, but at Theraputic levels, it is quite healthy.
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Old 05-25-2012, 08:25 AM   #104
Shawn M Wilson
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Re: TRT experience

The most amazing thing about testing ones Testosterone is that the scale is so huge. From like 110-1100. Most other blood work features such a smaller range.

And what is even crazier is that it is what is normal for each person (or should be for each person).

IE if you used to be sitting at 700 and now a year later your at 400, you will feel totally different. Also if you used to be sitting at 900 and now sit at 600 your still going to feel it.

As Bob said, unless ones doctor puts them on some extreme amount "ball" shrinkage and other issues are less common (can happen on an individual basis).

I mentioned this thread and discussion to one of my Crossfitting urologist buddies and we had a good discussion since a few of my fellow CFers do visit him for it. Most have experienced what "normal" recovery and a life for a person their age should have based on their routine/rest. He agrees the risk is low for the majority and the lifestyle improvement well out weighs the risk. Of course he talked about how he does blood work every few months to monitor and check levels to make sure the right amount is given and that a persons level stays consistent.

We have this knowledge, it helps people, use as directed and needed
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Old 06-02-2012, 08:19 AM   #105
Charley Agen
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Re: TRT experience

Bob I just updated the other thread I made and thought I would share it here as well. Not trying to double post, but didn't feel like typing a bunch more.

Well I just got my results back from my last Testosterone test. Total Testosterone was 293 (250-1100) and Free Testosterone was 60.8 (35-155). The Total T is what you usually want to be concerned with and I am just barely in the normal range. I was a little disappointed with the results, I was hoping they would be higher. I guess I am not that surprised gauging on how I have been feeling. I have been having about 4 days feeling pretty good and 3 feeling pretty crappy. Sleep has been decent about half the week on average. I'm still getting up to urinate at last 1x a night, sometimes 2 (really annoying). Libido is slightly there some days (the days I'm feeling pretty decent), others days non existent, which sucks for a guy in my late 20s.

I am kind of confused why my Doc used a different lab to analyze the test. Every lab uses different reference ranges. Although I can see where I fall in the range, I am not able to compare it to previous tests.

As far a training and diet. I eat a ton of food and don't worry about calories. I know I am getting excess, way above 3000 I would estimate. I'm about 180 pounds now and still pretty lean. I have a friend that started GSLP and started that a while ago and like the program. I'm making decent progress, but my strength is still pretty weak. I deadlifted 255 for 10 reps in my last workout for instance. I do notice that sometimes after I have a good workout (GSLP style: 3 sets of Deads, presses, dips, curls and metcon: 10 min amrap (1 round= 10 24" box jumps, 20 kettlebell swings) I will sleep really crappy and then will feel ultra terrible the next day (not always, but something I have noticed). I am doing GSLP lifts 3 days a week and 2 short metcons 2x a week. I don't think I'm over doing it, so I am kind of confused. The days then a I feel really crappy/fatigued/weak/cognitively foggy, I can almost sense that my T is very low that day, Anyway just an update. I am still waiting to hear from my Doc. I am really curious as to why he used a different lab.
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:08 PM   #106
Bob Herald
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Re: TRT experience

Wow charley those numbers are lower than mine when I started TRT. I had general low strength before TRT , now, my strength is more congruent to the amount I eat and train. Before it didn't add up. I ate X amount, trained and rested X amount, yet couldn't gain strength.

I just had my blood test after my third shot. My total test was in the mid 600's and free test was 100. So Im at the ideal levels now. And I get 400 mg of test cyp every 2 weeks. People say this is unusual and a lot. But my numbers are now good. If I were getting a lesser amount of test, it wouldnt be worth it.

Charley, did he give you a plan , natural or otherwise To tackle your issue ?
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:19 PM   #107
Bob Herald
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Re: TRT experience

I've been having some sleep issues the past few weeks. I don't know if it's the TRT, because I went off of anti depressants, or because I stopped my occasional use of nicotine.

I noticed that for a few days after my TRT shot I would have trouble falling asleep . Seemed like my mind was awake. Then 3 or so days after my shot I would sleep fine. For the last week or two, it's been every night. I go to bed, my mind is awake, I doze off and jolt back awake immediately. This happens for a good portion of the night until I finally fall asleep for good. I don't have any anxiety or worry or stress during these episodes... It just happens. Any ideas?
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Old 06-04-2012, 06:29 AM   #108
Charley Agen
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Re: TRT experience

Yeah Bob they are pretty dang low. As far as now I am still waiting to hear from my doc, but either way I am determined to try to naturally deal with this if possible. If I get to a breaking point then I will have to look for other means like TRT. I am interested in what my Doc has to say though.

As far as your sleep, I know that sleep issues are a sure fire symptom of low T, but if you are in the normal range and still not sleeping well it could be something else. I would talk to your Doc if it persists. Its good to hear that you are in the range now and that everything besides the sleep is where it should be.
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Old 06-05-2012, 07:34 AM   #109
Bob Herald
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Re: TRT experience

Natural is always better Charley. Youre right about that. In fact my doc called me to discuss my blood work. He asked what I wanted long term. I said that I didn't want to be on shots forever. So he said that we should ween me off the shots, by increasing the time between shot and see if my levels stay up. I didn't think this was possible . But he's a doc and he said sometimes, if you ween off, your body will start producing T again,and keep you at that higher level. If I doesn't work , I'll just go back on the shots.

I definitely want to decrease the dose anyway. I am more edgy and agressive than before. My girlfriend notices the difference. I am more snappy at her.

On a side note, I slept a lot better than usual last night. 50 mg Benadryl
Knocked me out LOL. Still not as perfect as I'd like though. I wish I could sleep and live and function completely naturally. But we're in an unnatural world. And sometimes have to use unnatural measures.
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Old 06-06-2012, 05:23 AM   #110
Charley Agen
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Re: TRT experience

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I wish I could sleep and live and function completely naturally. But we're in an unnatural world. And sometimes have to use unnatural measures.
Very true. When I was doing a lot of research into TRT, I found that most guys really liked either applying the gel everyday or taking a lower dose shot at once a week and sometimes twice. They said that this helped them get a more steady hormonal state. You might want to discuss this with your Dr. as well.
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