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Old 02-28-2006, 01:31 PM   #1
Daniel Miller
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Hello,
This is my first time posting and was wondering what people would say if I asked about determining whether I should be eating as a "small male", as a "hard-gainer", or as a “well-muscled”, "athletic male".
Let's see, I'm 26 5'8 around 145 and do WOD 3-5x per week. I'm an academic so spend most of my day reading or in class. I also climb at a climbing gym 3-5 days per week with varying intensity...meaning at times I've been training for bouldering competitions or a hard route while other times will just climb easy routes. I guess I would call myself an advanced level climber.
A 16 block meal plan would work well for me but I'd end up making up for it in a 2-3 cheat meals. My daily intake is around 16 blocks, which only equates to 1500-2000 calories per day. I'm wondering if I wouldn't see better performance by going up to 21 or even higher.

Ok, now for my second question. I have read about people making the claim that vegetables from the nightshade family cause inflammation. What is the biochemical/enzymatic validity of this?
I have experimented with the notion on my own and found that cutting out dairy and nightshade vegetables really had helped my recovery times, stiffness levels, and significantly reduced joint pains. Now, I want to know why.

Thanks in advance.
-Dan
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Old 02-28-2006, 01:36 PM   #2
Daniel Miller
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oh yeah, regarding block advice,
I forgot to include my lean muscle mass and or body fat. Well, that is because I don't have any calipers.
Let's see...I'm satisfied with my aesthetic appearance and so care much more for function over form. I really don't know my % B.F except that I can pinch barely an inch.
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Old 02-28-2006, 04:33 PM   #3
Garrett Smith
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Dan,
For the nightshade info you are looking for, go to www.noarthritis.com and look for the "Research" link. The main theoretical issue is the nicotine (given other chemical aliases in vegetables, ie. solanine in tomatoes) that certain people are very reactive to. I'm leaning towards everyone is sensitive to nightshades, not everyone reacts to them in the same manner and intensity though (much like "silent" gluten intolerances). I personally avoid gluten, dairy, and nightshades about 99% of the time in my diet and it has helped me considerably--keep it up if it's working!
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Old 02-28-2006, 05:27 PM   #4
Stanley Kunnathu
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It was hard to find a list of nightshade vegetables. I managed to find these:

Tomatoes, Potatoes, Eggplant, Peppers (of all kinds but not black pepper)and paprika.

Does this mean bell peppers are out?

This is all getting very complicated (do I need to get a horticulture degree?) and restrictive (more no's than yes's).

I don't know the science but I hope we're not throwing out the baby (good veg in the same "family") with the bathwater (tobacco).
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Old 03-01-2006, 06:38 PM   #5
Stanley Kunnathu
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What does nightshade refer to, anyway?
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Old 03-01-2006, 07:12 PM   #6
Steve Liberati
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Just recently, within the last month or so, I've been buying a big bag of frozen green peppers and onions at BJ's. They taste great with meats, eggs, chicken, etc.

Oddly enough, my urine has been smelling like a chemical by-product as of lately. The smell is just horrible. I wonder whether it is from the peppers and onions? I'm guessing it is.

Dr.G-
Is this common?

Daniel-
Don't mean to steal your thunder man. If you want me start a new thread that is cool with me. Just figured it sort-of related to this topic.
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Old 03-02-2006, 11:25 AM   #7
Garrett Smith
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Steve,
If you've recently changed your dietary habits, that could be it. Try not eating those things and see what happens, if no change, I'd highly suggest going and getting a basic urinalysis (it doesn't cost much at all). It's not a nightshade-related thing to my knowledge.

Yes, bell peppers would be out. It's really not that bad once one has found substitutes.

Stanley, I understand the "more no's than yes's" thing. We have been raised and live in an environment of too many choices. HG societies likely ate the same things day in, day out, depending on the hunt success and the natural growing season. The excessive choices we have are hand-in-hand with the general population's lack of health. It sucks, and that's just the way it is.

Humans didn't eat nightshades until the 1600's. Note that this was before times when we had all of this nutritional science getting in the way. That says something to huge to me about ancient people's empirical observations of what happens when one eats the nightshades. It's like watching what wild animals avoid eating to gain a general idea of what might be poisonous. Seeing modern science (what little there is on nightshades) plus the observations of ancient peoples is enough for me. Follow the money, you'll see why few people want to say the nightshades are bad. Tobacco, agriculture, painkillers, joint replacements, the list goes on and on. Why cure the problem with a simple dietary restriction if we'll hurt all of these industries?

From http://www.noarthritis.com/nightshades.htm:

I realized that these are all members of the Solanaceae family of plants, historically referred to as "nightshades". It is thought the name originated among the Romans who ground up a so-called deadly black nightshade and put it in an alcoholic drink intended for an enemy. The shade came down for a long night: they died. The botanical name for the black nightshade is Atropa belladonna L. Tobacco is also a member of this family of drug plants, which includes tomato, potato, eggplant, and peppers of all kinds (except black pepper).

So Atropa belladonna was used to kill people, tobacco is allowed to slowly kill people, many people claim reversal of their arthritis with nightshade avoidance. Hmmmmm. It's enough for me to cast a very guilty finger, especially after the resolution of much of my own joint pains after going nightshade-free.
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Old 03-02-2006, 04:17 PM   #8
Stanley Kunnathu
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I did read the origin of the word "nightshade" I'm a retard.

I'm going to go look for a more comprehensive list of edible Solanaceae plants.

It's sucks that bell peppers are out. I haven't really noticed joint pains yet (I'm 28).
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Old 03-02-2006, 07:38 PM   #9
Steve Liberati
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Thanks Doc. I'll look further into it and report back.
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Old 03-02-2006, 09:28 PM   #10
Garrett Smith
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Note,
Supposedly not everyone is susceptible to nightshades in terms of arthritis. That being said, Dr. Childers claims a 94% disappearance of arthritis symptoms with absolute strict adherence to the no-nightshade diet.

I know that nicotine, like alcohol, causes inflammation on some level in everyone. It's just part of the chemical's metabolism. I really like this article on nightshades:

Although the nicotine content of tobacco is much higher than that found in nightshade vegetables which are eaten, the practise of smoking reduces the amount of nicotine absorbed. The nicotine in a single cigarette, if taken direct into the bloodstream, would be fatal. Eating a single cigarette could cause severe illness. There are several instances of livestock poisoning where cattle or sheep have eaten nightshade plant leaves.
AND
If the nightshade foods were to be introduced to the Western diet today, under current Novel Foods regulations they would have to be tested for safety. It is unlikely that they would be permitted to enter the food supply, solely because of their nicotine (solanine) content. However, like cigarettes, they slipped into our diet despite some voices in opposition and have assumed a major role in our nutrition and health, a role that, in a free society, should be accepted.


I'm going to continue avoiding them, I advise my patients to avoid them as well.
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