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Old 02-14-2008, 12:01 PM   #1
Xavier Iturriagagoitia
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Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Hello,

For the last year I have been doing the 5x5 program on bench press, shoulder press, bent over row, deadlift and squat. I worked very hard on form but I got a couple of injuries...too many actually.

For the first injury I went to a doctor who basically only knew something about distance running.

Then later on I got another injury and went to aother doctor who seemed a lot more knowledgable.

Now everybody I have met "in real life" has told me the reverse of what I have learned on the internet (CF, t-nation).

I always believed that LOW rep (like 5), heavy weight is for STRENGTH, NOT hyperthrophy.
HIGHER reps (like 9-15) are less for strength, but more for hyperthrophy.

However the doctors told me that 5x5 is better for both strength AND hyperthrophy than 15 reps (I am using this number as "standard" higher rep number). However, since you are moving a heavier weight you will get injuried easier. This makes sense because with the 5x5 I got BIG, I more look like a bodybuilder ... and I want to avoid this!
Once all my injuries are 200% healed I'd like to start weights again. Howerver I am having doubts if I should do higher reps.
So from my experience the doctors are right that 5x5 is very good for hyperthrophy.

Will higher reps (like 9-15) make me a bodybuilder more than 5x5????
I know that it won't be as good for strength and it will take a longer time, but hell if I can lift something 15 times I can lift it 5 times right? I don't care if I will lose some strength... Most important is to make progress without injuries!

Thanks for clearing this up!
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Old 02-14-2008, 12:20 PM   #2
Anthony Bainbridge
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

If you're getting injured too much, you should spend more time finding a good coach. Worrying about rep schemes is the least of your worries at this point.
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Old 02-14-2008, 12:41 PM   #3
Xavier Iturriagagoitia
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Yea but a coach is usually expensive no?

And define a good coach. I see it happening: paying a guy who only lets me run/lift weights and no anaerobic stuff etc.
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Old 02-14-2008, 01:24 PM   #4
Christian Gotcher
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Then find a coach who will teach form on the exercises you are looking for specifically- you are the paying customer, so if the 'coach' just wants to take you from one curlmachine to another, you don't have to buy his service. There are Crossfit Barbell certs, thousands of resources online for proper form, Starting Strength as a theoretical background, and private coaches who teach form for the 'big lifts' (specifically look for Oly lifting and powerlifting coaches).
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Old 02-14-2008, 07:06 PM   #5
Nick Cummings
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier Iturriagagoitia View Post
Yea but a coach is usually expensive no?

And define a good coach. I see it happening: paying a guy who only lets me run/lift weights and no anaerobic stuff etc.
I would think a good coach could be less expensive than repeatedly injuring yourself.
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Old 02-14-2008, 07:15 PM   #6
Derek Weaver
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Nick is right. Finding a coach and paying a couple hundred bucks/month (may have to save for a little bit to afford it) for at least a little while is infinitely less expensive than recurring injuries. Not sure how it is in Belgium, but co-pays, missed work etc. are a pain here in the States.

A good coach should listen to your training goals and methods and accomodate accordingly.

Also, what kind of injuries are you dealing with? Is it one particular exercise that is bothering you?
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Old 02-14-2008, 09:49 PM   #7
Steven Low
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier Iturriagagoitia View Post
Now everybody I have met "in real life" has told me the reverse of what I have learned on the internet (CF, t-nation).

I always believed that LOW rep (like 5), heavy weight is for STRENGTH, NOT hyperthrophy.
HIGHER reps (like 9-15) are less for strength, but more for hyperthrophy.

However the doctors told me that 5x5 is better for both strength AND hyperthrophy than 15 reps (I am using this number as "standard" higher rep number). However, since you are moving a heavier weight you will get injuried easier. This makes sense because with the 5x5 I got BIG, I more look like a bodybuilder ... and I want to avoid this!
Once all my injuries are 200% healed I'd like to start weights again. Howerver I am having doubts if I should do higher reps.
So from my experience the doctors are right that 5x5 is very good for hyperthrophy.

Will higher reps (like 9-15) make me a bodybuilder more than 5x5????
I know that it won't be as good for strength and it will take a longer time, but hell if I can lift something 15 times I can lift it 5 times right? I don't care if I will lose some strength... Most important is to make progress without injuries!

Thanks for clearing this up!
wfs
http://web.archive.org/web/200605290.../sample200.pdf

Basically the sweet spot for PURE hypertrophy is about 8-12 reps or so (mix of myofib and sarco).

~3-8 RM is generally great for strength and hypertrophy (depending on diet of course) and tending more towards strength and myofib hypertrophy as you approach 1 RM. Also, this occurs on the opposite 12->20 tending towards more endurance and sarco hypertrophy.

Basically if you want strength and *applicable* (strength related) hypertrophy stick around the 3-5 RM area.
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Old 02-15-2008, 12:53 PM   #8
Xavier Iturriagagoitia
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Cummings View Post
I would think a good coach could be less expensive than repeatedly injuring yourself.
That makes sense, why didn't I think about that?

Thanks Steven for answering the original question (although I appreciate all the given advice).

Looks like I will buy starting strength ( I hate the word starting ) and keep my eyes open for a good coach. Once my ringtraining DVD ships I will train upper body with rings and follow the DVD (it's almost a coach...) while I look for a coach.
Does anyone happen to know good coaches in Belgium?

Thanks a lot for all the advice. Asking a question like this would get me flamed to death on most forums!
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:09 PM   #9
Johan Nederhof
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Xavier,
Send me an email, I am in Rotterdam, the Netherlands, only a couple of hours drive from you.
j dot nederhof AT zonnet dot nl
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Old 02-15-2008, 02:29 PM   #10
Anthony Bainbridge
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Re: Question about hyperthrophy & maximum strength

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier Iturriagagoitia View Post
Does anyone happen to know good coaches in Belgium?
Visit some powerlifting and/or weightlifting gyms - the ones that cater to competitive lifters. More than likely you'll find awesome knowledge and great partners.

Just a side note - you mentioned a dvd is almost a coach. Not even close. A coach can watch what you do, while you do it, offer immediate feedback, corrections, cues, etc. They'll also be able to tell when you have more in the tank, when you're out of your league, when you need rest, and when you need to work harder.
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