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Old 01-07-2006, 07:55 PM   #21
James Hall
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Guys,
I work for a nationally well known (if not disparaged!) rehab company as a simple PT. If I could do things over again, I would become a DC and incorporate the knowledge I already have as a PT. Fortunately, I have a loving wife and 3 kids and can't afford to change things at this point. Otherwise, I wouldn't have to deal with ignorant (with regards to rehab) MDs and could really direct patients in the correct direction.
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Old 01-07-2006, 07:56 PM   #22
James Hall
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Ben,
You and I need to hook up. I like your attitude and approach!!
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Old 01-07-2006, 09:02 PM   #23
Garrett Smith
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Lisa,
There are some DOs who are continuing on the grand tradition of OMM. I applaud them, I wish there were more of them. Some of the DOs that I've asked if they do OMM look at me like I'm crazy, that I'm asking them to become witch doctors. There's also my buddy who went through 1.5 years of DO school and said it was the 'this bug, this drug' education pattern typical to MD schools. He graduated with me from ND school.

There is a place for all of these practitioners, it's too bad there's this one big, powerful group trying to smother everyone else into submission. It's a good thing the 'free market' won't have it and is now speaking up for themselves.

Dr. G
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Old 01-08-2006, 06:12 AM   #24
Daniel Carney
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Joe,

I specialize in a form of manual therapy called structural integration (more commonly known as Rolfing). Structural integration specifically addresses postural alignment issues. I have helped many with scoliosis, and other structural imbalances of the spine.

In addition, I have worked along side DC's, PT's, and DO's. I always recommend people get a few referrals and "interview" their healthcare providers.

I used www.iasi.org to see if there were any practioners in your area, and there are 23 in MA. Try this link to see the list http://www.theiasi.org/find.php?CITY=&STATE=MA&PROVINCE=&COUNTRY=&MATCH=S TARTS&H ITS=50&form=FIND&Submit=Find. One of them might be close enough for a visit. You can also learn more about structural integration from-
www.idaprolf.org
www.rolfguild.org
www.rolf.org

Good luck!
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Old 01-08-2006, 12:48 PM   #25
Joe Miller
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Thank you very much Daniel; many of those are in my area. I will look into this.
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Old 01-09-2006, 09:23 AM   #26
Garrett Smith
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Joe,
I'd suggest you look into combining both "soft" and "hard" approaches. Rolfing for the soft tissue, and CBP for the hard tissue (bone/ligament) would be a heck of a combination. There would definitely be a synergy there.

Z-Health by Dr. Eric Cobb (www.zhealth.net) has been of great help to me lately with my neck and middle back issues.

Dr. G
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Old 01-09-2006, 05:26 PM   #27
Ben Krey
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I think it is dangerous to get into a peen fight about which technique is superior. After all, two practitioners of the same technique are going to be completely different.
Having said that, I have seen both CBP and Rolfing get some great results.
Joe, I honestly don't think the experts could agree whether your lumbar kyphosis is actually a problem. Chiropractors put a huge emphasis on structural integrity and its relationship to nerve function as well as muscle function.

My assumption from a musculoskeletal standpoint is that you probably have chronically weak hip flexors and tight hammies and need some core work.
(not a diagnosis, lol)
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Old 01-09-2006, 11:43 PM   #28
Jason Erickson
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Garret -

Thanks for your endorsement of Scott Sonnon's methods. A little explanation:

Dr. Cobb's "Z-Health" system is based on material he learned from Scott Sonnon. This was back when Scott was known for Sambo instead of conditioning. At that time, the program Cobb studied under Sonnon was called "Zdorovye" - the source of the "Z" in "Z-Health." Looking at Cobb's site, every photo shows an exercise straight out of "Zdorovye", which evolved and grew into the body of work now called "Circular Strength Training" - of which Clubbells are a part.

I highly recommend updating to Scott's new and vastly improved materials, particularly his "Intu-Flow" program. There's a ton of free info on www.ClubbellTrainer.com or feel free to e-mail me.
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Old 01-10-2006, 09:44 AM   #29
Garrett Smith
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Jason,
I understand that what Coach Sonnon brought back with him from the Soviet Union (along with subsequent modifications) heavily influenced Dr. Cobb's creation of Z-Health. I don't deny this, and Dr. Cobb gives credit to Coach Sonnon on his DVDs and in the name of his modality (as you stated). He also gives credit to many other health practitioners who influenced him and Z-Health, including Moshe Feldenkrais, Tony Blauer, and Craig Liebenson, among others.

After undergoing an evaluation by Dr. Cobb and receiving my specific joint mobility prescriptions (along with very specific added visual/vestibular components that I don't believe are a component of Sonnon's work), I feel pretty comfortable saying that Dr. Cobb's work has truly progressed from what he learned from Coach Sonnon into a highly viable musculoskeletal treatment modality.

I believe it is fair to say that a cursory examination of the zhealth.net website doesn't even begin to address the breadth nor depth of the evaluation and treatment protocols involved in the current Z-Health. I know that I didn't understand until being treated and observing all of the facets involved. For example, I have mid- to lower thoracic pain on my left side. Dr. Cobb performed his evaluation along with having me try to elicit the pain (it's not always present, right lateral spinal flexion plus spinal flexion is how I guage it). I was having trouble eliciting the pain that day. Dr. Cobb then had me look inferior and right with only my eyes while trying to elicit the pain, and BOOM. Lit me up like a bonfire. A specific eye movement pattern was then prescribed along with my specific joint mobility exercises. Another strange coincidence, when I light up like that, the pain usually hangs around for a week after that--my pain was 95% gone the next day, leading me to believe that the oculomotor pattern was a very significant influence. If Coach Sonnon is doing anything like this, I'd like to know about it. I also know that I only saw the very surface of what I believe Z-Health to encompass.

I don't believe that Coach Sonnon 'created' joint mobility exercises, just as he didn't 'create' clubbell exercises. He did bring them to a modern America, and he has added his own touches. I also know that it's not the tool (ie. the very rudimentary joint mobility exercises shown on the website), rather it is how one applies it.

That being said, I also know that I am not as up-to-date on RMAX's material as you are. We both may be a bit ignorant regarding each other's chosen modalities. I do receive the CST newsletter(s) and try to read them when I can. If you have specific recommendations of articles, I'd love for you to email them or PM me. In my judgement, I've found wading through most of the articles on the site somewhat tedious, as I judge that they often cover what seems to be the same topics over and over again, along with what seems like constantly adding to the needed "exercises" that one should do in the course of a day--this is why I liked the laser-like precision with which Dr Cobb prescribed his work. That's why I'm asking you, someone well versed in that site, for your recommendations.

BTW, you are one of the few posters to the SuperTraining newsgroup I read anymore. We should definitely talk more over email in the future. I apologize to anyone who felt our posts were too far off-topic.

Dr. G
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Old 01-10-2006, 09:52 AM   #30
Tim Weaver
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Actually, as a lay-person, I found your discussions to be very interesting. But then I am weird in that I like learning new things about which I have no previous knowledge.

Tim
being redundant
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