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Old 08-22-2006, 05:55 AM   #41
Daniel Foster
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Larry you could have not said that any better.And Jay asking who you would rather have defend your self Shogun or Joe Kravmaga is a little silly. I do not know if your aware of this or not, but Lee Murry was stabbed in the chest pretty badly not to long ago in a fight in a night club, where was all of his MMA training
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Old 08-22-2006, 08:25 AM   #42
Dan Strametz
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Jay look at what you said in your last paragraph about natural movements. Then in your second statement you say the complete opposite.
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Old 08-22-2006, 09:08 AM   #43
Jeff Martin
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Jay,
For the sake of argument, and so that we are discussing the same thing, in terms of Modern Army Combatives can you define winning in a self defense situation?

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Old 08-22-2006, 09:26 AM   #44
Mike Kirkpatrick
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Jeff,

I am obviously not Jay, but I do know a good bit about the military (I want to be a SEAL, and am pretty informed, but no real world experience to speak of)...I'd define winning in a CQB hand-to-hand situation as neutralizing the threat. However that is attained, it doesn't matter. I also have a hard time believing that there are 340 cases of hand-to-hand combat between one soldier and one insurgent. Where was his Squad? Fireteam? Why didn't he use his Beretta or knife instead?

Ted, MMA was not developed for fighting an opponent with a weapon. I don't care who you are, if a weapon is pulled out and you don't have a weapon or a way to even the odds, you better run like heck. I don't think that Jeff Martin would advocate doing any kind of karate chop neck strike (or whatever) against a guy with a gun or knife...unless it is a last resort (ie: he wants you to get in the trunk of his car, etc). If somebody wants your wallet or car and they have a weapon drawn on you, I think the safest move is to comply...let the cops handle recovering it.
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Old 08-22-2006, 09:49 AM   #45
Jeff Martin
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Mike,
Thanks. Let's see if Jay agrees with you on the definition.
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Old 08-22-2006, 09:58 AM   #46
Patrick Johnston
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I might add that I believe there are many different ways to kick a$$. What I liked about what Brand X taught me (and by extension KM) was the benefit of training under extreme duress. Many, many techniques will work IF one has the presence of mind to execute them in a given situation. Therefore, one, to be optimally prepared, should train the technique as well as the situation. This, in my experience is missing from many self-defense programs.

My experience grappling on a mat with another person or my time spent boxing in a ring with another person do, I believe, enhance my ability to defend myself. If I wanted to optimally train myself for self-defense, I would add training under various stressful scenarios as well.
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Old 08-22-2006, 11:25 AM   #47
Kris Crowley
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As an LEO, I will tell you that the best way to defend yourself is to exercise your Second Amendment rights.

I was doing Kajukenbo in Tucson until I found out that there was an MMA school where Don Frye trains as well as a few other MMA fighers who are now going to IFL. I have been there for about three months and have learned more there than my four years in Shaolin Goju and the five months I wasted in Kajukenbo.

I know in a brawl, I will most likely prevail, but in a street fight, anything can happen. That is why I suggest exercising your Second Amendment right to defend yourself. All the Bruce Lee techniques in the world can help you, but don't guarantee anything. Neither does packing a .40 caliber handgun. But, I'll take the odds of my gun over trying to defend against a few gangbangers anyday.

Like what was posted earlier, self-defense is a lot different than getting into a fist fight with some drunk dude. Therefore, for self-defense, one should have all the tools available to him or her. That would include among other things, knowing some self-defense techniques, but also having the other tools, like a gun, to defend yourself. Gouging someone in the eyes and kicking him in the groin usually isn't as effective as three well-aimed shots, center mass.
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Old 08-22-2006, 11:36 AM   #48
Daniel Foster
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but just make sure when using a Gun that the justifaction for using that kind of force is called for or you might find your self in prision
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Old 08-22-2006, 01:06 PM   #49
Peter Queen
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I’m going to have to agree with Daniel. Carrying around a pistol or any kind of gun at all times is not something I am a great fan of. I'm all about our constitutional right of protecting oneself with whatever. And carrying around a weapon is certainly ok in my book by the military or in the law enforcement services but if I am out and about with my wife and kids I don’t want to worry about rather or not I might need to use a gun to go to the movies or visiting Aunt Sarah.
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Old 08-22-2006, 01:19 PM   #50
Garry Berryhill
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Use of a firearm is as much a martial art as any other. If anything, the killing power of a firearm is such that you should train it harder than anything else.

Massad Ayoob's articles and books are incredibly educational for anyone learning how to carry concealed. They have certainly opened my eyes to the legal ramifications of carrying in public. Personally, before I get my permit I'm going to Gunsite and/or the Lethal Force Institute. Ideally, not only will I get fine shooting instruction, but having done so will help me legally should I ever have to fire my weapon.

"Every bullet comes with a lawyer attached." I dunno who said it, but it's true.
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