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Old 06-05-2008, 04:53 PM   #11
Robert Peck Fletcher
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Re: POSE running

Michael, How is the ruck? You have a good question. My first answer would be that POSE would not be good for rucking. Running with a heavy ruck would not be advised. Now, sometimes you will need to trot to make up time or distance but definitely not a flat out run. Also, you have to think about your feet. Tough feet are really important. I see soldiers that do not ruck frequently go out with a 70lb. ruck for 12 miles and jack their feet up. Blister after blister that will take many days off to recover. This means missed training time while your feet heal. Start and slow and light. Get with some one who has spent some time under a ruck and start asking questions. Good luck.
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Old 06-05-2008, 06:36 PM   #12
Michael Wengloski
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Re: POSE running

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Peck Fletcher View Post
Michael, How is the ruck? You have a good question. My first answer would be that POSE would not be good for rucking. Running with a heavy ruck would not be advised. Now, sometimes you will need to trot to make up time or distance but definitely not a flat out run. Also, you have to think about your feet. Tough feet are really important. I see soldiers that do not ruck frequently go out with a 70lb. ruck for 12 miles and jack their feet up. Blister after blister that will take many days off to recover. This means missed training time while your feet heal. Start and slow and light. Get with some one who has spent some time under a ruck and start asking questions. Good luck.

Appreciate the advice. I have not got to try out the ruck yet. It is at my house and I am still in Japan for another 2 weeks. I'll be getting some use out of it while i'm home and be sre to take it with me to my next duty station.
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Old 06-06-2008, 12:52 PM   #13
Dave Parmly
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Re: POSE running

I use a ruck when training for a backpacking trek. Use a 50 pound load in the pack I'll be using, wear the boots I'll be wearing on the trek. I walk a mile hard, then do 3 sets of stadium steps then a 1/4 mile, 3 sets of steps again and repeat so you end up with 2 miles total and 5 sets of stairs (It's not a huge stadium...our local HS stadium.)

For my CF routines, I often sub a run with flights of stairs in our corporate HQ with a 35# load in a day pack, waist belted, sternum strapped and pretty snug to prevent too much jostling. Depending on the WOD, I run for time or for flights.

Stearns makes a water sack we use BP-ing and it hold right at 20# of water so 1 or 2 depending on the scenario. I use Nalgenes to make up the rest for a 35# load. Water allows for precise measurement of weight and good bulk.
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Old 06-07-2008, 05:45 AM   #14
Christian Lemburg
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Re: POSE running

Michael, Robert,

about POSE and running in army boots and/or with a ruck: don't do it, it will not work, due to the high heel of the boots forcing you to stay up on your toes in an artificially high position if you try conciously to stay on the toes. This will cause injuries, especially with added loads.

I have tried this during winter time some years ago, running to work in army boots with a 10kg ruck. I was running "POSE-style" on the ball of the foot already for quite some time by then, and had run in a variety of shoes from normal running shoes to minimal shoes, aquasocks, and barefoot. So I concluded naively - why not in army boots. I did it, and after some runs I had developed a peroneal tendinitis with swelling that needed rest for about a week and medication. Due to continued dumbness on my part (refusing to rest), it took me more than one year to fully recover from that tendinitis. (I learned about trigger points that way, which may have been good for some people on this board and elsewhere, but ... ;-) ... )

The problem with running POSE-style in army boots is that you try to get that tip-toe running feeling, and for that, you need to rise on the toes of your feet into an artificially high position, due to the high heel of the shoe, which is very unstable and forces your peroneal muscles into a cramped contracted state that soon affects the peroneal tendons, causing swelling and pain under the outside anklebone (malleolus lateralis). Running with a ruck increases the load, increasing the chance of injury.

If you have some POSE running experience, and run naturally in POSE style or similar form on the balls of your feet without thinking, you can run in army boots and with a ruck. Just don't try to run in POSE consciously. Just run. Due to the way the boot is made, you will contact ground heel first. If you run correctly using leaning forward etc. this will actually not be a problem as your weight is already shifted forwards so the impact will only come when you are standing on your full foot.

The point of this discussion is:
- POSE is not about staying on the tip of your toes regardless of shoe
- it is about the weight being forward when ground impact occurs (leaning forward)
- it is not really important which part of the shoe touches the ground first (design of the shoes plays the most important part here), but where the center of gravity is relative to the ground point of contact when foot loading occurs
- so if you wear high-heeled shoes, it is OK to hit the ground with heel first, since it can not be avoided without a cramped extension position of the foot
- you want to avoid that cramped extension of the foot since it will produce problems with your peroneal muscles and tendons that act to stabilize the foot laterally

Hope that was understandable,

Christian
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Old 06-07-2008, 05:49 AM   #15
Christian Lemburg
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Re: POSE running

Ah, and of course one more problem is that with a heavy back pack, relaxed leaning forward in POSE style is actually quite difficult since the pack pulls you back and swings around on impact.

Just to mention it,

Christian
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