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Old 04-06-2014, 05:53 PM   #1
Hakan Yilmazkaya
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Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

Hey there, i have been combining wendler's 5/3/1 and my affiliate's local wods for a while and seen great benefits in terms of strength and size gains. I have fat to lose, that's why i'm on a cut since 1 month and planning to cut till the beginning of june. I like the results, i keep losing fat but my problem is with deadlift day of wendler's. I have done Lascek's program and SS for a while too and they just suggests doing deadlift for just 1 set for 5 reps. Wendler's deadlift day is taking too much of you especially if you are on a cut and lack some energy. That's why i wonder if you guys have any experience with modifying it because i'm seriously thinking about it. I have 2 options in my mind;

1- My local box has high rep deadlift wods once a week. Just do them and nothing else in terms of deadlift.

2- Do something like SS, i mean working for just 1 heavy set every week.

Or do you have something in mind ? How do you think doing one of those effect my performance ? Thanks.
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Old 04-06-2014, 06:29 PM   #2
Robert Fabsik
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

Are you following the Wendler percentages and using an accurate Training max?

Honestly, I never find the first 2 works sets in 5/3/1 to be that difficult on any day. They are tough but very doable. So in my mind, 5/3/1 really has one hard work set (the last one) as opposed to SS or other linear programs.

I think the high rep deads might be taking more out of you. What other assistance work are you doing?
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Old 04-06-2014, 06:48 PM   #3
Hakan Yilmazkaya
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

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Originally Posted by Robert Fabsik View Post
Are you following the Wendler percentages and using an accurate Training max?

Honestly, I never find the first 2 works sets in 5/3/1 to be that difficult on any day. They are tough but very doable. So in my mind, 5/3/1 really has one hard work set (the last one) as opposed to SS or other linear programs.

I think the high rep deads might be taking more out of you. What other assistance work are you doing?
On other movements, yes i don't find the first two sets hard to do either but on deadlift, i find it more difficult and consuming. As assistance training, i do wods. It's hard to explain but i find my box's wod heavier than necessary, so i scale our wods to find a balance between an assistance work and metcon. But i'm seriously thinking about changing to boring but big template and doing wods as conditioning (by minimizing the reps and weights). You think i should do that or keep going with what i'm used to do ?
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Old 04-06-2014, 06:53 PM   #4
Eric Montgomery
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

I agree with Robert--the first two work sets on 5/3/1 are basically what I'd be doing anyways as warmup sets before my single heavy set of 5+. I think the high-rep deadlifts are to blame here.
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Old 04-06-2014, 09:16 PM   #5
Robert Fabsik
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

Of course the other variable is your form.
If your pull is really ugly, I can see it really hammering the lower back. Feel free to post a vid if you want.

In regards to using WODs for assistance work, it can be done, but is often tough to find the right balance for the weights and time domains.

In regards to going to Boring but Big. What are your goals?
If you are making great progress now, you may want to drop high rep deadlifts and keep moving forward.

If your goals are more strength and hypertrophy focused, then going to Boring But Big makes sense.
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Old 04-07-2014, 06:47 AM   #6
Hakan Yilmazkaya
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

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Originally Posted by Eric Montgomery View Post
I agree with Robert--the first two work sets on 5/3/1 are basically what I'd be doing anyways as warmup sets before my single heavy set of 5+. I think the high-rep deadlifts are to blame here.
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Originally Posted by Robert Fabsik View Post
Of course the other variable is your form.
If your pull is really ugly, I can see it really hammering the lower back. Feel free to post a vid if you want.

In regards to using WODs for assistance work, it can be done, but is often tough to find the right balance for the weights and time domains.

In regards to going to Boring but Big. What are your goals?
If you are making great progress now, you may want to drop high rep deadlifts and keep moving forward.

If your goals are more strength and hypertrophy focused, then going to Boring But Big makes sense.
If both of you guys say the same thing, i'll remove high rep deadlifts and go on. Thank you.

Robert;

I am a naturally thin guy. I mean i have the bone structure of a woman, that's why i always aim for some hypertrophy, especially need some shoulder and chest muscles. More important is strength gains. First time in my life i'm feeling strong, thanks to cf and wendler's, and i want to keep getting stronger and stronger.
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Old 04-07-2014, 09:52 AM   #7
John Holcombe
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

I actually had a similar experience with wendler 5/3/1 and deadlift day. I remember doing a set of 315# for max reps (i got 10) and feeling so beat up from it that I didn't want to do much else.

My recommendation - on Wendler you're supposed to go for max effort on your third set right? I'd say just stop at the number of reps it says for deadlifts. Instead of doing 5+ (which might end up being as many as 10) you stop at 5. You should still make progress.
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Old 04-09-2014, 10:00 AM   #8
Mark Boyle
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

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Originally Posted by John Holcombe View Post
I actually had a similar experience with wendler 5/3/1 and deadlift day. I remember doing a set of 315# for max reps (i got 10) and feeling so beat up from it that I didn't want to do much else.

My recommendation - on Wendler you're supposed to go for max effort on your third set right? I'd say just stop at the number of reps it says for deadlifts. Instead of doing 5+ (which might end up being as many as 10) you stop at 5. You should still make progress.
I think this is great advice.

Another option would be to go by how you feel. Most DL days, just do the required reps but if you feel good (maybe once every cycle or two) do more. Jim has said something to this effect many times.
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Old 04-09-2014, 11:32 AM   #9
Dana Rice
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

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Originally Posted by John Holcombe View Post
I actually had a similar experience with wendler 5/3/1 and deadlift day. I remember doing a set of 315# for max reps (i got 10) and feeling so beat up from it that I didn't want to do much else.

My recommendation - on Wendler you're supposed to go for max effort on your third set right? I'd say just stop at the number of reps it says for deadlifts. Instead of doing 5+ (which might end up being as many as 10) you stop at 5. You should still make progress.
I've had great success with 5/3/1 and trying to manage my fatigue on the + set by always trying to leave 1 rep in the tank. I never go to failure, and I never go for a rep I know I wont hit. Once you start getting into heavier weights, this helps tremendously with recovery, and being able to get enough volume to spur progress.

Also, listen to your body. I like 5/3/1 because it has a semblence of autoregulation built in. On the days you are feeling it, go for it, the days you aren't - get minimum work in. To go in ahead of time with the mindset you are only going to do 5, 3, or 1 rep regardless of how you feel that day, I think would be counterproductive.

EDIT: basically what Marc Boyle said, just read his post
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Old 04-27-2014, 09:34 PM   #10
Steven Thunander
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Re: Wendler's 5/3/1 and Deadlift day

If I recall reading correctly, you are supposed to stop with a little left in the tank on your 5+, 3+, and 1+ sets. You don't go for max reps.
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