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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 01-22-2005, 12:30 PM   #1
Troy Archie
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I’m looking to implement Dan John’s version of Dave Turner's program (, to go along with my WOD and I’ve got a few questions I’d like to ask before I go gung ho. For starters, can front squats be replaced, or better yet, rotated with overhead squats? This question might seem a bit obvious but I just want to make sure; after day five do you have a day six, which would be an off day, or do you start up again back at day one?

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Old 01-22-2005, 12:56 PM   #2
Dan John
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Sure, of course. Nothing magical about the program, just an attempt to answer a couple of questions. Let me know if this works "better," I would be interested to see if the lighter OSs keep you from burning out...
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Old 01-22-2005, 06:16 PM   #3
Ryan Atkins
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Hi Troy,

I had good success using this formula:

DAY 1 Warm-up/WOD/snatch 8setsx2reps
DAY 2 Warm-up/WOD/c&j 10setsx1rep
DAY 3 Warm-up/WOD/REST

I usually rested around 60-90 seconds between sets. I rotated the load of my projected maxes 70/75/80 %. I never squatted unless written into the WOD.

It's from Coach Rutherford (full post at and was the approach he used before placing second in his first O-lift meet. I checked my records. I started using this approach in the middle of August. By early October (the 6th) my max C&J increased by 20# (205# to 225#)

I believe this approach works for several reasons:

1.) It focuses on the two most technical lifts presented in the Turner program.

2.) It avoids overtraining by taking out simple pressing and squatting motions - which, IMO, are already amply covered by the WOD.

3.) It makes for a nice, whole body warm-up that is fun and demanding (especially technically), but still leaves plenty in the tank for the WOD.

Hope this helps,

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Old 01-23-2005, 07:12 AM   #4
Larry Lindenman
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Great post Ryan. Think of the lifts you could improve by incorporating this template: Squat, bench press, DL, OVERHEAD SQUAT.
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Old 01-23-2005, 09:27 AM   #5
Barry Cooper
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You can also roughly overlay a Westside-type program. In the first triplet, you do WOD then Speed Bench day one; WOD plus speed squat/deadlift day two; WOD only day three. Next triplet, WOD plus max bench day one; WOD plus max deadlift or squat day two; WOD only day three.

I don't think supplemental deadlift work is needed, so I would do back or front squat if I did "legs", as I think added work is needed to increase your totals in those.

I've also made Day 3 my "grip" day. I don't fuss much with it, but I've got some Captains of Crush grippers, a pinch grip thing, a Rolling Thunder and a few other odds and ends. I do a basic workout with those after the WOD.

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Old 01-24-2005, 01:17 AM   #6
Rene Renteria
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Barry, have you ever done heavy finger rolls for grip training? Here's a page describing them from a climber:

I was wondering if you might comment on that routine versus yours and why one might be better or if they work different aspects or types of "grip". I'm interested in terms of finger strength for climbing and have been trying to add in some grip work. (But I usually feel so worked by the WODs that I haven't been doing them--yet!) Also, what do you feel has worked best for you in terms of increasing grip strength?

Thanks for any comments,
(Should I be putting this in a new thread?)
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Old 01-24-2005, 05:45 AM   #7
Lynne Pitts
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New thread on grip stuff would be good...
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Old 01-24-2005, 09:04 AM   #8
Barry Cooper
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Beats me. Grip strength is not something I know much about. I am going to get a fingerboard at some point. That looks like good exercise, and the climbers I know really seem to like them. Of course, the best way to build climbing strength, or so I've heard, is to climb. It makes sense. has a lot of fun stuff, and there are several books on grip strength. I have John Brookfields book, and have read it, but I haven't done the stuff, so I can't comment on it.
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Old 01-24-2005, 09:48 AM   #9
Ross Hunt
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One-arm lockoffs (chin grip) are really fun grip training. Coach Sommer recommends them as pull-up training:

I did these for a couple months. I got my best chin P.R. (21) when I tapered off my bodyweight chin training with a couple weeks of lockoffs and then tested my bodyweight reps on a weekend. The rate of progress is really inspiring, too, especially in the first month: I went from a brief 1-2 second lockoff on each arm to a 20 second lockoff on each side in two months. Then I hit a wall, though; for some reasons, all isos seem to get dramatically harder after 20 seconds.
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Old 01-24-2005, 12:32 PM   #10
Christopher Sommer
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If you are hitting a wall at 20 seconds, I would recommend adding enough resistance to drop back to 2-5 seconds and then gradually building up the duration of the lockoffs to 20 seconds again.

Yours in Fitness,
Coach Sommer
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