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Old 08-06-2014, 11:17 AM   #11
Struan Potter
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Jordan Cotter View Post
Kind of. I really enjoy front squats and power cleans, but like I said, I'm just tired of bruised swollen collar bones. And when the collar bone gets swollen it gets bigger and becomes even more of a problem. I like for exercises to bulk up my muscles, not my bones.

I'd like to take Potter's advice if I understood it a little better. I understand the last part, but the last time I did front squats, I did them with pullups so my biceps were a bit swole and made it a little harder to get a full grip under the bar.
Pushing up through the bar takes the weight off the shoulders and puts it on the back. This will help with keeping the torso straight as you stand up.

Do your pull ups after your squats then.
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Old 08-06-2014, 01:09 PM   #12
Clint Harris
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Jordan Cotter View Post
I am definitely guilty of wide feet when the weight gets heavy. I didn't think that was a sign of bad form until I noticed how narrow the feet of the athletes were and how deep they went on the speed clean ladder this year in the crossfit games. Then I really questioned my form...
They were doing full cleans during that ladder. Power cleans will usually (and by definition) will usually be caught in a squat that is above parallel. Most of the time we're in a 1/2-1/4 squat rather than a 3/4 or greater.
Anyway. Foot work is important as it shows some stability and "landing position" in an athletic position. Feet will be anything from in place to only a few inches out. It also matters greatly on how you meet the bar too - does it crash into you or do you literally catch it - like soft hands when catching a ball.
When landing with wide feet - it's more like you are no longer fast enough to get under the weight, so rather than drop by bending knees/hips, we squirt our feet out wider in an nonathletic and non-stable position, and literally have the bar crash into us.
Before Dan Bailey learnt how to squat clean, he'd power clean everything and was a great example of sending feet out when weight got heavy.

Here's a random video that shows it too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30_-CMyfi_U WFS
No idea who this guy is or care to comment on form. It's probably comparable to most average jokers - including myself.
In the beginning, you can see his feet barely move (other than to jump). He's almost muscle cleaning it, but that's beside the point. He is remaining somewhat athletic and the bar is landing reasonably soft on his rack.
As the weight gets heavier - in that 8-9 minute time frame. You can literally see his form break. He shoots his feet out to get low rather than drop deeper into the squat (without it being a full clean). The bar is going to smoke him each time the bar is landing ontop of him, rather than him meeting it (he also sort of controls the weight with a reverse curl to minimize the impact).
You can see he feels this by trying to cue his elbows around - but he should cue a deeper and faster pull under too (elbows around fast, but also practice landing fast and how you want simultaneously). Make sure he's fast elbows AND fast/deeper/athletic squat.
If that even makes sense. Takes some commitment and awareness.
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Old 08-06-2014, 01:11 PM   #13
Matthew Swartz
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

Post a video of your form.
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Old 08-06-2014, 04:13 PM   #14
Tate Dimech
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Jordan Cotter View Post
It's with a heavy heart I am considering this. I'm just so tired of having bruised and swollen collar bones.
I think it's a sign of me getting old. I used to do front squats and cleans with no problem, without even thinking about my form or keeping my elbows up. Now I do everything I can do keep my elbows up and have good form and it seems like the damage to my collar bones are unavoidable.

My collar bones are already larger than they used to be and I don't want them to look like Rich Froning's some day. His protrude pretty far. I'm guessing it's from years of what I'm talking about here.

I guess I just posted this for some sympathy or maybe for somebody to talk me out of it. I don't know...
Not sure if srs...
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Old 08-07-2014, 04:11 AM   #15
Blair Robert Lowe
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

There is something to be said about training in a t-shirt instead of a tanktop. It helps so the bar doesn't chew up your back or neck as much. Of course this is also because of the knurl on the bars I'm using.

You could try doing cleans maybe in a sweatshirt. Add some layers to give you some padding similar to padding your pubic bone on snatches.

It'll suck in the heat.

Worst option I can think of is using a bar pad. We had a little old lady in her 50's and probably not even 100# (she was probably 4'9) so both I and the National 105 WLer preferred if she didn't use that pad because it changes the way you receive and front squat or the rack for the jerk.
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Old 08-07-2014, 06:27 AM   #16
Richard Colon
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Jordan Cotter View Post
Kind of. I really enjoy front squats and power cleans, but like I said, I'm just tired of bruised swollen collar bones. And when the collar bone gets swollen it gets bigger and becomes even more of a problem. I like for exercises to bulk up my muscles, not my bones.

I'd like to take Potter's advice if I understood it a little better. I understand the last part, but the last time I did front squats, I did them with pullups so my biceps were a bit swole and made it a little harder to get a full grip under the bar.
For the Front Squat part at least, try the crossed arms thing. You even see games athletes do it during high rep Front Squats. Most likely that is just to save the arms/wrists/elbows because of other movements in the workout but still..

It is the bodybuilder way, usually a result of lacking the flexibility/mobility to do it in the olympic rack position. I also have no clue if it helps with any of your pain issues, as I don't front squat that way. Also, it will obviously have no carry-over into cleans but still, it might work for you being able to get in some Front Squats at least.

then..when you start to Front Squat 300+, regardless of what hand/arm/shoulder/wrist position you are in, you might not be as reluctant to do cleans.

Overall, I still vote for either ditching them all together - it isn't the end of the world, or training more traditional front delts and/or get used to it (suck it up). Weightlifting can be hard and it can hurt (very different than injury). That stuff sucks. You either 1) Don't weightlift or 2) Weightlift anyway and deal with the suck. This is life. You often cannot have the benefits of something without enduring the pain of it first. Grind through it.
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Old 08-07-2014, 07:19 AM   #17
Bill Walker
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

Have you considered working with a coach?
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Old 08-07-2014, 01:59 PM   #18
Daniel OBrien
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Jordan Cotter View Post
My collar bones are already larger than they used to be and I don't want them to look like Rich Froning's some day. His protrude pretty far.
Yeah, I would hate to have Rich Froning's body...
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Old 08-08-2014, 02:37 AM   #19
David Alexander
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

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Originally Posted by Matthew Swartz View Post
Grow some delts.
This is pretty much the best advice ever.
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Old 08-08-2014, 05:34 AM   #20
Dare Vodusek
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Re: I am sadly considering giving up clean/front squats

Btw, what is the best exercise to "grow some delts"
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