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Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

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Old 07-06-2008, 06:49 PM   #11
Wade Smith
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

Just like with a posted WOD, you get what you get. Maybe next year's challenges will include a 5k row or Eva or Murph. Maybe not.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:10 PM   #12
Frederic Giraud
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cavazos View Post
Aerobic capacity, mainly. Endurance and just being able to grind would also be represented, I suppose.
I see where your going but strictly speaking, aerobic capacity is expressed within a minute, or two max, of continuous effort. Remember the power output they are expressing. You don't need to grind through 20 or more minute in order to tax your aerobic capacities within this kind of power generation.

so no need to go through a lot of time with a much smaller power generation, just need to bust a lot of power within a short time and you are taxing your aerobic capacities a lot.

Dr. Tabata kind of demonstrated this.

As for Endurance, the fact of doing 3 wods within a 12h timeframe is quite a lot of endurance. No recovery doesn't play that much into the equation when we are speaking of such a little time frame.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:23 PM   #13
Joe Cavazos
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

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Originally Posted by Frederic Giraud View Post
I see where your going but strictly speaking, aerobic capacity is expressed within a minute, or two max, of continuous effort. Remember the power output they are expressing. You don't need to grind through 20 or more minute in order to tax your aerobic capacities within this kind of power generation.
Umm... from the CrossFit Journal "What Is Fitness?" pdf:

Quote:
Just remember that efforts at moderate to high power and
lasting less than several minutes are anaerobic and efforts at low power and lasting in
excess of several minutes are aerobic. As an example the sprints at 100, 200, 400, and
800 meters are largely anaerobic and events like 1,500 meters, the mile, 2,000 meters,
and 3,000 meters are largely aerobic.
The 5-minute workouts the Games was made up of are anaerobic. A 5K would be aerobic.

Quote:
As for Endurance, the fact of doing 3 wods within a 12h timeframe is quite a lot of endurance.
Not really. First of all, people's muscles were mostly recovered by the time the next workout started. Secondly, the movements that comprised the workouts were different enough that no muscle was being blasted the whole day.

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Originally Posted by Wade Smith View Post
Just like with a posted WOD, you get what you get.
Why should this stop anyone from discussing whether or not that Games could have been a better test of overall fitness? Do you think Coach and his staff were like "***** it, they get what they get," when devising the workouts? If they saw fit to care, I don't see why we shouldn't be allowed to.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:33 PM   #14
Frederic Giraud
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

I'll let other chim in.

But how do you explain that a 4 min work out ( tabata ) enhance aerobic capacities then?

It's short, it's high power, but taxes,thus develop, the aerobic capacities.

As for muscle being mostly recovered in 4 hours, I do not agree. again high power output/high intensity even if for low times depletes alot the glycogenic reserve.
Glycogenic reserve takes a lot of time to be "mostly" back to normal level ( 24h-36h to get back to full) and I doubt you'd be eating much that would get you enough sugar in that blood to get absorbed by the muscles. Some part of the reserve would be back of course, mostly tho? I strongly disagree.

and then by the next workout, since the reserve are already a bit depleted, the system won;t be able to be used for as long, and aerobic would take the relay sooner, thus expressing aerobic capacities even more. And then we have the 3rd wod, where the aerobic component would start to kick in even sooner...

We're all here to learn tho, so correct me if i;m wrong.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:40 PM   #15
Alix Clark
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

Nothing scientific to add but I too was a bit disappointed that there weren't some longer workouts in there - 5k run/row etc. I think some ppl are great at the shorter workouts while others have strengths in the longer ones so would have been good to see a mix of the 2 (for eg I know ppl can post a kicking 500m row time but a pretty average 5k row time - two completely different beasts). Either way, I'm looking forward to competing next year and fingers crossed for a 5k row!
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:44 PM   #16
Anthony Bainbridge
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

Work capacity and therefore recovery.

Work capacity isn't a 1 time event of how far can you run, how much can you lift, or how hard can you push for 5-20 minutes.

It's a "let's so something really ****ing crazy, rest a little bit, and then repeat it again, and then again. Then let's give you a few hours sleep, let the DOMS set in, and then give you something nasty and see how you can handle it."

These events had nothing to do with energy systems. Everything, and I think all competitors will agree, was revolving around testing work capacity and recovery.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:46 PM   #17
Dylan Eddy
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

i have to admit i was dissapointed the games had no "longer" workout. by that mean something like the trail 5k from last year. im sure the powers that be had their reasons and im not going to second guess them. but. i was left thinking that the results would have been very different had the time domain been broader.
i will say that i thought the choices for the different exercises was pretty solid. Burpees, deadlifts, pull ups and thrusters dont favor any one demographic (except maybe short guys)

also, three Wods in a day is really taxing but its not a test of endurance its a test of recovery. to me endurance means little or no rest between activities. the rest periods totally change the physical demands IMHO.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:47 PM   #18
Anthony Bainbridge
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

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Originally Posted by Joe Cavazos View Post
Not really. First of all, people's muscles were mostly recovered by the time the next workout started. Secondly, the movements that comprised the workouts were different enough that no muscle was being blasted the whole day.
Did you compete Joe? I ask because if you did and you still hold this statement to be true, then I'm wondering why I'm not seeing you in the top 3.

Don't take that too personally, but NO ONE was fully recovered from one workout to the next and I can tell you that certain areas did get hammered to **** and if you heard the competitors gaming the upcoming events, you certainly got a feel for where people were hurting.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:49 PM   #19
Chris Salvato
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

Useful thread:

http://www.board.crossfit.com/showthread.php?t=33012

Specifically view response #19 and #20...

The games adequately tested all 3....

Those times were well over 30 seconds which leaves it to be a huge aerobic component. Even 3 minute Fran was mostly aerobic.
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Old 07-06-2008, 07:51 PM   #20
Dylan Eddy
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Re: No long workouts for the Games

yup that makes alot of sense. work capacity. outright. then the ability to repeat that level of output more than once.

this games format would have tested the HELL out of that.
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