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Old 05-04-2010, 07:01 PM   #11
Júlíus Magnússon
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

I eat fruit for ALL my carb blocks. I just don't care enough to down 2lbs of veggies per day.

If you're really after "elite" bodycomposition/performance/whatever more veggies is probably the way to go. But if fruit is the worst thing you're eating, you're doing pretty damn good already.

P.S.
Seriously, at one point I was getting 90% of my carb blocks from fruit juices and I was still at 8% body fat.
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Old 05-04-2010, 09:04 PM   #12
Ryan Ransom
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
Yes, this. A typical banana has just over a hundred calories. An apple has about 80. Both are packed full of micronutrients. If you're slugging down olive oil because you're afraid to eat fruit, might I suggest that your nutritional approach might be a wee bit skewed?

Katherine
Quote:
Originally Posted by Júlíus Magnússon View Post
I eat fruit for ALL my carb blocks. I just don't care enough to down 2lbs of veggies per day.

If you're really after "elite" bodycomposition/performance/whatever more veggies is probably the way to go. But if fruit is the worst thing you're eating, you're doing pretty damn good already.

P.S.
Seriously, at one point I was getting 90% of my carb blocks from fruit juices and I was still at 8% body fat.
Ok - first off, don't worry - I haven't gotten to the point that I'm drinking olive oil. Couldn't do that. I just want to to stay lean and am wondering if cutting out some fruit would help that. I admit that I don't think I could eat the veggies required to get my carbs for the day. The reason this even came up is because I was doing 23p/18c/60g fat and I felt like I wasn't as lean after about a month. I've now changed it to 21p/16c/40f and I'm wondering if the problem was too much fruit or too much fat. From what I've read I don't think it's the fat. I guess I'm still just trying to figure out the healthiest version of carbs to eat that doesn't equal a copious amount of food.

Thanks!
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Old 05-04-2010, 09:17 PM   #13
Eric Montgomery
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Ryan Ransom View Post
So how much fruit are we talking here? One or two pieces a day (2-4 blocks)? Less, more?

What would good sources be other than veggies? I'm thinking anything that has a low GL (I take it that means glycemic index? or does it mean glucose?). To me that would be things like black beans/kidney beans or oatmeal or occasionally my Genesis 1:28 sprouted grain and seed bread. Would you say that, referring to non-veggie carbs, a good rule of thumb is high fiber means low-GL?
GL is glycemic load, which is a more accurate way to assess a food's impact on your blood sugar than GI alone is. This (WFS) is a good summary of GI and GL. The basic idea is that some things may be high GI but sugar is present in such small amounts that its overall effect on blood sugar is fairly minimal.

A good rule of thumb for low-GI or low-GL is that you'd have to eat a lot of it to make up any significant amount of calories. One tablespoon of sugar might have the same calorie content as 2 cups of broccoli (hypothetical example with made-up numbers) so the broccoli clearly has a lower GI and GL.

Black beans, kidney beans, bread, and oatmeal may not be the best choices as far as helping your leaning-out process.
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Old 05-05-2010, 06:48 AM   #14
Ryan Ransom
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Eric Montgomery View Post
GL is glycemic load, which is a more accurate way to assess a food's impact on your blood sugar than GI alone is. This (WFS) is a good summary of GI and GL. The basic idea is that some things may be high GI but sugar is present in such small amounts that its overall effect on blood sugar is fairly minimal.

A good rule of thumb for low-GI or low-GL is that you'd have to eat a lot of it to make up any significant amount of calories. One tablespoon of sugar might have the same calorie content as 2 cups of broccoli (hypothetical example with made-up numbers) so the broccoli clearly has a lower GI and GL.

Black beans, kidney beans, bread, and oatmeal may not be the best choices as far as helping your leaning-out process.
So veggies are really the only good choices for carb blocks with the intent of leaning out? Boo... I don't mind veggies, it's just so much and it gets expensive. What about just eating less carbs in general by replacing with fat blocks. I'm at 16 blocks carbs right now so I could drop it so that I'm sitting around 100g a day (about 11 blocks) and replace the removed 5 blocks with 15 blocks of fat and then I could eat six of those blocks after the WOD (eating 50% carbs post WOD is good according to Wolf) and spread the remaining 5 among my five other meals. Is that enough carbs in a day?
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Old 05-05-2010, 07:26 AM   #15
Ryan Ransom
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Ryan Ransom View Post
So veggies are really the only good choices for carb blocks with the intent of leaning out? Boo... I don't mind veggies, it's just so much and it gets expensive. What about just eating less carbs in general by replacing with fat blocks. I'm at 16 blocks carbs right now so I could drop it so that I'm sitting around 100g a day (about 11 blocks) and replace the removed 5 blocks with 15 blocks of fat and then I could eat six of those blocks after the WOD (eating 50% carbs post WOD is good according to Wolf) and spread the remaining 5 among my five other meals. Is that enough carbs in a day?
Addendum referring to removing carbs (missed the 30 minute window):

If I did do that should my starting point on fat remain at 40 blocks or should I drop it down to 20 blocks before replacing carbs with fat? Keeping it the same would put me at 76 blocks a day (including the ~21 from protein) and ~2,010 macronutrient calories total whereas as going back to 20 would give me 56 blocks a day (again, including protein) and ~1,970 (which seems low).

All that being said, as I just changed this past Friday to the 21p/16c/40f, I should probably wait and see what happens before I start to change anything again. For how I'll just try and stick with veggies and make sure the occasional fruit is low GL.
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Old 05-05-2010, 08:00 AM   #16
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Ryan Ransom View Post
If I did do that should my starting point on fat remain at 40 blocks or should I drop it down to 20 blocks before replacing carbs with fat? Keeping it the same would put me at 76 blocks a day (including the ~21 from protein) and ~2,010 macronutrient calories total whereas as going back to 20 would give me 56 blocks a day (again, including protein) and ~1,970 (which seems low). .
You're obsessing about a 40 calorie difference? You probably don't know your intake OR output accurately enough for that to matter.

As for carbs, total calories is more important than GI, assuming you're not diabetic. If you want more carb calories, eat more fruit, starchy tubers, and grains. If you want fewer, eat more veggies.

IMO, 2000 calories is probably not enough. That's about what I eat. But I generally side with those who feel that supporting activity and muscle building is more important than bf%.

Katherine
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Old 05-05-2010, 11:59 AM   #17
Ryan Ransom
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
You're obsessing about a 40 calorie difference? You probably don't know your intake OR output accurately enough for that to matter.

As for carbs, total calories is more important than GI, assuming you're not diabetic. If you want more carb calories, eat more fruit, starchy tubers, and grains. If you want fewer, eat more veggies.

IMO, 2000 calories is probably not enough. That's about what I eat. But I generally side with those who feel that supporting activity and muscle building is more important than bf%.

Katherine
Heh, Didn't notice that it was only 40 calories different. I feel slightly foolish.

As for calories - it's more than 2000 calories because I'm only factoring the main macronutriet in the foods I eat. If you were to include all three in each thing then it would be more. Honestly, as much as it might not seem like it, my goal is to be able to put on muscle and support my CF activity. I just want to do it while staying lean. Do these have to be mutually exclusive? I hope not...
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Old 05-05-2010, 02:16 PM   #18
Katherine Derbyshire
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Re: Carb blocks from fruit

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Originally Posted by Ryan Ransom View Post
Heh, Didn't notice that it was only 40 calories different. I feel slightly foolish.

As for calories - it's more than 2000 calories because I'm only factoring the main macronutriet in the foods I eat. If you were to include all three in each thing then it would be more. Honestly, as much as it might not seem like it, my goal is to be able to put on muscle and support my CF activity. I just want to do it while staying lean. Do these have to be mutually exclusive? I hope not...
Oh, right, I forgot about block math. If you're going to count blocks, don't count calories. Converting between the two is essentially impossible. You'll just confuse everyone, including yourself.

Katherine
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