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Exercises Movements, technique & proper execution

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Old 09-04-2009, 12:20 PM   #31
Dimitri Dziabenko
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Re: People dont understand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renee Lee View Post
i've been cfing a year and still don't have a pull up
Sorry, I don't claim to know how long it takes for women. My GF got one rather quickly, but she was 18 and not the norm in terms of strength.

Generally a man without too much excess body fat should be able to work up to a pull up within a few months, given a methodical progression. The pull up is also in some of the novice SS programs, ie. not exactly something that Rip anticipates will take years to develop.

Given your avatar, I am pretty sure if you focused on getting a deadhang pull up with a focused progression, you could get it very very soon. It was wrong of me though to assume that these guidelines apply across the board, which they obviously don't.
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Old 09-04-2009, 12:22 PM   #32
Calogero Vassallo
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Re: People dont understand

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Originally Posted by Jamie J. Skibicki View Post
you need better hand care and kipping practice.
Well the coach at the gym said my form is spot on its just I keep doing them every day to get better and the callus just keep ripping open.
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Old 09-04-2009, 01:43 PM   #33
John Seiler
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Re: People dont understand

Power is work divided by time. The same amount of weight (your body) going the same distance in less time = more power. We're doing GPP here; not bodybuilding. When doing metabolic conditioning, power output is the key.

The strict pullup is fine exercise, btw. We use it all the time but again this is General Physical Preparedness. We wouldn't use a strict pullup to get over a wall or into tree in an emergency.

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Originally Posted by Michael Ricketts View Post
Everytime I workout in the base gym I get someone come over and tell me I am cheating my pullups. EVERY TIME! So I quit arguing and now I thank them for their valuable input, tell them that I am impressed by the amount of weight they are curling and ask when they are going to be done in the squat rack.
Say, "Does that mean running is cheating compared to walking?"

Then make the outline of a box with your fingers and say, "This is the box."
Point to the middle of the imaginary box and say, "This is you. Think outside the box."
Then tell them the above.
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Old 09-05-2009, 12:41 PM   #34
Brendan Barr
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Re: People dont understand

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Originally Posted by Calogero Vassallo View Post
Well the coach at the gym said my form is spot on its just I keep doing them every day to get better and the callus just keep ripping open.
Watch Rips video on the press progression. He talks about bar placement in the hand. It has really helped me to cut down on torn calluses.
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Old 09-05-2009, 03:23 PM   #35
Oliver Gould
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Re: People dont understand

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The strict pullup is fine exercise, btw. We use it all the time but again this is General Physical Preparedness. We wouldn't use a strict pullup to get over a wall or into tree in an emergency.
You wouldn't use a kipping pullup either. There's nowhere to swing on a wall, you'd use a combination of a strict pullup and pushing with your feet. Getting into a tree would also involve climbing with your feet, or performing something like a bar muscle-up. If this is the standard for choosing exercises we should all be building obstacle courses.
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Old 09-05-2009, 09:20 PM   #36
John Seiler
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Re: People dont understand

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Originally Posted by Oliver Gould View Post
You wouldn't use a kipping pullup either. There's nowhere to swing on a wall, you'd use a combination of a strict pullup and pushing with your feet. Getting into a tree would also involve climbing with your feet, or performing something like a bar muscle-up. If this is the standard for choosing exercises we should all be building obstacle courses.
Hey, thanks smart guy. Your "point" only elaborates on mine: What you describe in either circumstance is the fastest (read: most powerful) way of moving your body a certain distance. In a GPP workout with pull-ups the kip generates the most power. The kip also teaches you to move your body in the most efficient way to raise your head over the bar. You may recall that coordination is one of the measurements of fitness. And GUESS WHAT? Power output and contribution to developing coordination are excellent standards for choosing an exercise.
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Last edited by John Seiler : 09-05-2009 at 09:31 PM.
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Old 09-06-2009, 06:36 AM   #37
Oliver Gould
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Re: People dont understand

Actually my point doesn't elaborate on yours at all, since all I wrote was that you wouldn't use a kipping pullup to get over an obstacle.

Quote:
The kip also teaches you to move your body in the most efficient way to raise your head over the bar. You may recall that coordination is one of the measurements of fitness. And GUESS WHAT? Power output and contribution to developing coordination are excellent standards for choosing an exercise.
In the scenario you describe, you need to get your whole body over a solid object, not your chin over the bar. Practicing climbing over a wall will get you good at climbing a wall. Practicing a kip will get you good at a kip. Coordination is one of the least transferable traits of fitness than Crossfit chooses to focus on. The are perfectly good reasons for choosing kipping over strict pullups, especially in metcons or for developing upper-body work capacity, but the idea that they more accurately mimic a real-life situation isn't one of them.
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Old 09-06-2009, 07:18 AM   #38
Carlos Cristan
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Re: People dont understand

So you don't think being able to do a fairly respectable number of kipping pullups is going to help someone create power and momentum from core to extremity to assist them in getting from a dead hang position on the edge of a wall to on top of the wall.
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Old 09-06-2009, 08:42 AM   #39
Oliver Gould
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Re: People dont understand

Given a choice between a respectable number of kipping pullups or no pullups at all, I'd obviously take the respectable number of kipping pullups. Fortunately for people training GPP, adaptations from training are both general and specific, so the general adaptations from kipping pullups will likely help someone climb a wall. The idea that a kipping pullup promotes a specific adaption for anything other than more kipping pullups strikes me as false. If kipping pullups are compared to regular pullups in terms of real-world utility, the comparison is between the general adaptations they promote, since a kipping pullup is no more analogous to any real situation than a strict pullup. I'm not arguing that one or the other is better, there's a huge thread on that, but the OP asked how he should explain the kipping pullup to a friend who considered it cheating. I don't think:

Quote:
We wouldn't use a strict pullup to get over a wall or into tree in an emergency.
is a good explanation at all. The fact that a kipping pullup is a metcon intensive pulling exercise is a much better reason to consider it a valuable tool for GPP. Crossfit is supposed to promote general adaptations for GPP, lets not exaggerate what it does by claiming it provides specific adaptions as well.
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:46 AM   #40
Dimitri Dziabenko
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Re: People dont understand

I think it's really the muscle ups that are supposed to cover the "getting over an object" adaptation. If you want it to be more specific to your job, I think obstacle courses may be involved there.
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