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Old 04-28-2008, 04:23 PM   #1
John Atkinson
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Need a Little Help with the Math

Hey guys,

I'm doing Crossfit 5x/week and playing basketball 3x/week. I walk lots.

I'm 186 pounds, and according to the military body fat chart I'm 11-12% body fat.

I don't follow the Zone but I have started (very recently) eating very Paleo. If it hasn't recently been swimming, flying, running, crawling, or growing, I pretty much don't eat it. I eat lots of fat free cottage cheese (360 calories per 16oz.) I eat with an emphasis on protein with little to no simple carbohydrates. I consume healthy fats from nuts and seeds as well as lean meat (96% lean hamburgers on a whole wheat roll, etc.) I eat between 2,000 and 2,500 calories per day. I drink a lot of water and green tea (Diet Lipton).

I'm extremely tall (6'4") and lanky, but I don't have visible abs. I'm hoping Crossfit can help me shed the small bit of fat that's around my midsection. I'm looking more for the "David Beckham" kind of leanness instead of the "David Draper" kind

-Is Crossfit 5x a week with that sort of diet enough to shed this fat relatively quickly?
-Should I be eating more? Less?
-Should I be doing more cardio, less cardio, or focus on different lifts?
-What's a realistic timeframe for my goals? I'll put my goal at 8% body fat.

Any answers help!

Thanks!
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Old 04-28-2008, 04:50 PM   #2
Brad Thompson
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

Is beer on the menu?

I started the zone diet about a month ago and lost 15 lbs. so far. I am 6'4 and went from 245 to 230. I don't think I've changed anything as far as calories go, just the combinations/types of foods. I'm eating 23 - 25 blocks a day.
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Old 04-28-2008, 05:04 PM   #3
George Mounce
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Atkinson View Post
Hey guys,

I'm doing Crossfit 5x/week and playing basketball 3x/week. I walk lots.

I'm 186 pounds, and according to the military body fat chart I'm 11-12% body fat.

I don't follow the Zone but I have started (very recently) eating very Paleo. If it hasn't recently been swimming, flying, running, crawling, or growing, I pretty much don't eat it. I eat lots of fat free cottage cheese (360 calories per 16oz.) I eat with an emphasis on protein with little to no simple carbohydrates. I consume healthy fats from nuts and seeds as well as lean meat (96% lean hamburgers on a whole wheat roll, etc.) I eat between 2,000 and 2,500 calories per day. I drink a lot of water and green tea (Diet Lipton).

I'm extremely tall (6'4") and lanky, but I don't have visible abs. I'm hoping Crossfit can help me shed the small bit of fat that's around my midsection. I'm looking more for the "David Beckham" kind of leanness instead of the "David Draper" kind

-Is Crossfit 5x a week with that sort of diet enough to shed this fat relatively quickly?
-Should I be eating more? Less?
-Should I be doing more cardio, less cardio, or focus on different lifts?
-What's a realistic timeframe for my goals? I'll put my goal at 8% body fat.

Any answers help!

Thanks!
Get rid of the Diet Lipton and make real unsweetened green tea. Lipton puts crap in there you don't want, or need.

You say very Paleo...then a whole wheat roll. Whole wheat, wheat, grains of any kind...are not Paleo at all, far from it.

Cardio is a very bad word - it doesn't describe anything. You are doing cardio sitting in a chair typing on the keyboard of your computer. You should be doing CrossFit.

If you don't know what you eat (as in you aren't measuring what you eat) you will never be able to tune your diet accordingly. The Zone allows you to do this.

Leanness isn't a goal. Performance based on timing your workouts, making sure you tally your weights and see increases that way is a viable method.

Welcome to the reality of real training. Aesthetics is a side effect of CrossFit, not a goal.
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Old 04-28-2008, 05:58 PM   #4
John Atkinson
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

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Originally Posted by George Mounce View Post
Leanness isn't a goal. Performance based on timing your workouts, making sure you tally your weights and see increases that way is a viable method.

Welcome to the reality of real training. Aesthetics is a side effect of CrossFit, not a goal.
These are my goals. So yes, leanness can be a goal.

Thanks for the help so far guys!
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Old 04-29-2008, 02:00 AM   #5
Jay Cohen
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

John;

George is spot on.

Numerous threads on people looking to "Get Ab's, or Get Lean". Use the Search function

You want lean, stay in the kitchen and hone your diet. You want strong, do the WOD, lift heavy weight over head.

BTW, Fat Free stuff is a Marketing Departments Dream.
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Old 04-29-2008, 03:41 AM   #6
Tony Hill
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

I'd agree with going for performance based goals instead of appearance based. Kind of like how the FAQ states, "Those athletes who train for function end up with better form than those who value form over function. This is one of the beautiful ironies of training. "

I think it could be argued that in many cases, going for performance and dialing in that diet is going to give you the results you need without even bothering with a scale or the mirror.

I'd also like to note that trusting military charts to calculate your BF or to judge yourself is probably not the most accurate thing. It is kind of like going by BMI. I'm overweight on the BMI scale, and I often break my max weight in the AF for my height, but I'm not rocking a lot of bodyfat so I don't trust them or even pay attention to what they say I should be.

Calculate goals based on performance and get tested regularly to find out your actual BF. Remember that the more specific your goals are, the more likely you are to meet them.
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Old 04-29-2008, 05:13 AM   #7
George Mounce
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

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Originally Posted by John Atkinson View Post
These are my goals. So yes, leanness can be a goal.

Thanks for the help so far guys!
Your goal can be accomplished via the smoking and champagne diet.

It tells me a lot about you by stating that your goal is to be lean. Because body fat % can be obtained by starving yourself, it is a pretty selfish and unfulfillable goal. So what I believe you really want to say is you want to have an excellent diet and functional body. Will your body fat % be lower? Yes, if you train intensely across all broad time and modal domains a la CrossFit.

You want to look good, I get that, but leanness doesn't look good. Functional does.
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Old 04-29-2008, 06:00 AM   #8
Jaime Steele
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

Pictures speak louder than words - me after 6 months of Crossfit and good diet. Was fairly fit before starting but in a completely different way.

http://steele7.com/me.gif
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Old 04-29-2008, 07:09 AM   #9
John Atkinson
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

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Originally Posted by Tony Hill View Post
I'd agree with going for performance based goals instead of appearance based. Kind of like how the FAQ states, "Those athletes who train for function end up with better form than those who value form over function. This is one of the beautiful ironies of training. "

I think it could be argued that in many cases, going for performance and dialing in that diet is going to give you the results you need without even bothering with a scale or the mirror.

I'd also like to note that trusting military charts to calculate your BF or to judge yourself is probably not the most accurate thing. It is kind of like going by BMI. I'm overweight on the BMI scale, and I often break my max weight in the AF for my height, but I'm not rocking a lot of bodyfat so I don't trust them or even pay attention to what they say I should be.

Calculate goals based on performance and get tested regularly to find out your actual BF. Remember that the more specific your goals are, the more likely you are to meet them.
I am an athlete and really should train for function over aesthetics. I'm just not interested in adding body fat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by George Mounce View Post
You want to look good, I get that, but leanness doesn't look good. Functional does.
You're right, and I apologize for my testy-ness earlier.

I'm really interested in performance. If I work the WOD intensley and suppliment that with sport specific training, I should get the results I'm looking for in those areas, no?
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Old 04-29-2008, 09:21 AM   #10
Ryan McKenzie
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Re: Need a Little Help with the Math

john-

absolutely, the intense/fast-paced nature of the WOD's is a recipe for fat-burning. and if you only fuel your recovery with good foods then you will start to see the aesthetic results you are after.

try to get used to the attitude some people take when you express that some of your goals pertain to a bit of vanity, but don't take it personally. I have found that some people will bark at for their own good, and not so much for your own good.

the point they intend to make is that training hard for strength/function/endurance/metcon, etc will have the side-effect of a leaner appearance (if your diet is dialed-in). most people on the forum just prefer to keep that aspect hush-hush.

my suggestion to you if you are looking to burn those last few lb's of bf around the middle would be to emphasize diet FAR more than your workout structure. You are attempting to lose the absolute peskiest few percentage points of bf that reveals the 6 pick and you will probably ONLY be successful if you eat perfectly and train HARD, but rest assured the WOD's should be enough (for the training side) if you are an active person. The D. Beckham look will boil down to caloric intake and quality.
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