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-   -   Plateauing.... (http://board.crossfit.com/showthread.php?t=67761)

Patrick Eichmann 06-08-2011 06:34 AM

Plateauing....
 
Looking for some advice:

Ive been active in crossfit and general fitness activities, e.g. Running, lifting routines, etc for the past 7 years and have noticed that I'm starting to plateau, or even lose strength, is some of my crossfit related workouts. For example, at one point a year ago I had no problem completing multiple sets of 12 pull ups. Now I struggle in completing sets of 9. Same goes for the flat bench. I had no problem benching my body weight (185-190) a few years back but now struggle in putting up anything over 170.

Any idea why this plateu is taking place and what I can be doing to reverse it? I have been more focused on running recent but still work in 2 or 3 days of CF or lifting

Thanks in advance

Ryan Saraco 06-08-2011 06:40 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Need more information. How is your diet? Has it changed? How much are you running, what does your routine look like? If you are losing unintentionally strength, something is wrong with your diet or your training.

Patrick Eichmann 06-08-2011 06:50 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
I typically will run 2 to 3 days a week, mixing up running work outs, and hit the gym 3 days a week. For the lattter I typically alternate from doing crossfit or circuit with doing push/pill workouts. Depending on the day I may go to the gym in the morning and do a light jog in the afternoon after work.

In terms of diet I'll admit ice jumped around a bit. I followed a paleo diet for a yr or so but it didn't work for me so I started to scale back on eating a ton of meat and focused more on veggies with a small portion of protien at most meals. I have also added some grains back into my diet but only do so in slight moderation.

Dan Graziano 06-08-2011 07:46 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
take a full week off maybe your body is just burnt...mentally as well as physically

Eric R Cohen 06-08-2011 08:32 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945632)
I have been more focused on running recent but still work in 2 or 3 days of CF or lifting

Thanks in advance

Sounds like this is your answer. Is your running improving? Look at runners vs lifters...if your are spending more time running, other areas will be neglected. Seems simple.

Katherine Derbyshire 06-08-2011 08:43 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945642)
In terms of diet I'll admit ice jumped around a bit. I followed a paleo diet for a yr or so but it didn't work for me so I started to scale back on eating a ton of meat and focused more on veggies with a small portion of protien at most meals. I have also added some grains back into my diet but only do so in slight moderation.

Inadequate food is a very common cause of plateaus. Might be worth looking at your total calories and your macro breakdown.

Katherine

Patrick Eichmann 06-08-2011 09:18 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Yea, when it comes to running my endurance is building...

In terms of calories, using a standard BMR formula I need 2350 calories a day...thats before factoring in my activity levels. I probably eat close to the 2350 figure but may fall below a little.

I'm wondering if I'm over working myself?

Eric Montgomery 06-08-2011 09:22 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
If strength is a main goal of yours....more food+more heavy lifting+less running.

A bodyweight bench press shouldn't be a difficult feat for a grown man if he's training smart and eating enough to recover.

Katherine Derbyshire 06-08-2011 09:50 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945741)
In terms of calories, using a standard BMR formula I need 2350 calories a day...thats before factoring in my activity levels. I probably eat close to the 2350 figure but may fall below a little.

Then you're not eating enough to do anything but sit on the couch. Eat more.

Katherine

Patrick Eichmann 06-08-2011 01:32 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Thanks.

Katherine, what do you recommend? I do probably consume more than what my BMR states but wouldn't eating more be counterproductive? Eating more would probably equate to weighing more which would make pull-ups, for example, more challenging.

again, appreciate all the advice and comments everyone.

Eric Montgomery 06-08-2011 01:40 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
You're unable to bench bodyweight. A few extra pounds should be the last thing you're worrying about.

And no, those pounds won't significantly decrease your ability to do pullups provided that there are strength gains accompanying your weight gains.

How many pullups can you do? Unless the answer is 30+ dead hangs, you're probably being limited by strength, not by your weight.

Damon Stewart 06-08-2011 01:57 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
I've been Crossfitting about the same amount of time. IMHO most people don't make much in the way of gains in CF after their 1st or 2nd years because they've maxed their anaerobic adaptation and are attempting to raise that anaerobic peak higher without changing the fundamentals beneath it. Most of what they consider gains past that point are strength or skill.

Here's what I do: 1st, I gain 5-7lbs every summer by going on heavy lifting cycle. Usually I'll be up as high as 10lbs and then come back down. When I started Crossfit I was somewhere in the low 150's, now I'm at 177 and headed up to 185 later this summer. Every time I do this my squat, dl, press, and O-lifts have increased correspondingly. I felt like when I was finally able to front squat 315 that all the thruster weights typically used in CF became easy.

2nd, there's something to be said for having an aerobic base. (Heresy, I know.) Your anaerobic capacity is in some ways a derivative of your aerobic base and it's much easier to increase the top when the base of the pyramid gets bigger.

3rd, you get better at what you practice. I squat 2-3x week, train Oly at least 1x/week and depending on the cycle up to 3-4x, and I do gymnastics practice before every workout.

Regarding food I'd just eat as much clean food as you can. I'm like the converse of the Okinawan 80% rule: I always eat until I'm 120% full but what I eat is pretty much strict Paleo.

Katherine Derbyshire 06-08-2011 02:38 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945869)
Thanks.

Katherine, what do you recommend? I do probably consume more than what my BMR states but wouldn't eating more be counterproductive? Eating more would probably equate to weighing more which would make pull-ups, for example, more challenging.

There are degrees of eating more. If you're sliding backward, there's a good chance you're not eating enough to support adequate recovery. You would have to eat even more than that to actually build muscle, and still *more* to have "excessive" weight gain.

Katherine

Patrick Eichmann 06-09-2011 06:31 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Does anyone have any recommendations for building up my pull up threshod or over all strength? I've done the 5x5 stuff before but wondering if there's any other approaches I should be considering.

Michael Dowling 06-09-2011 06:42 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
just bench more, eat more food too.

seriously though, i know when i did CF WOD's it was just metcon, metcon, amrap, 20-30 minute brutal conditioning and very little strength, we NEVER benched ever. in a few months my bench went from 245 to about 190 in a blink of an eye.

the only thing that surprises me about your issue is that pull ups suffered, mine got much better as i dropped body fat.

Eric Montgomery 06-09-2011 10:13 AM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 946129)
Does anyone have any recommendations for building up my pull up threshod or over all strength? I've done the 5x5 stuff before but wondering if there's any other approaches I should be considering.

I just told you before to look at a strength-focused program if you want to get stronger--like 70s Big, CFFB, or GSLP. There's no magic tricks needed to get your bench above bodyweight, you just have to do more lifting, more eating, and less endurance stuff if you want to get stronger in a reasonable amount of time.

As for pullups, doing something like frequency method would help. You say your max set of pullups is currently 9, so do 4-5 sets of 4 pullups spread throughout the day. After a few weeks, try a max set and see where you are. If you do 12 at that point, increase your 4-5 sets to 6 reps each. And so on. You can do the same thing on pushups.

Brendan McNamar 06-09-2011 02:46 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
We need more info:

age
weight
height
and current lifts

Eating small amounts of protein will make you weaker. I'm going to guess already you are too lite based on the running and lack of strength.

Every time I hear a guy say they eat 2300 calories maybe, I wonder how they get out of bed in the morning. Doing CrossFit, lifting heavy I need like 4300 a day minimum or I start to loose weight. I have to force myself to eat. Only high body fat new people can lose weight and gain strength at the same time.

For people like you I like Zone to insure you eat enough. Keeps the eating clean and forces you to eat enough or at least know you didn't. Forget the never eat more then 5 blocks at once. Set yourself up at 5 x 6 block meal plan a day for a couple of weeks. Do strict barbell training; squat, bench, press, dead lift and power cleans. Get enough sleep. Easy on the running. I expect you will start to reverse the strength lose.

David Hansen 06-09-2011 03:40 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945869)
I do probably consume more than what my BMR states but wouldn't eating more be counterproductive? Eating more would probably equate to weighing more which would make pull-ups, for example, more challenging.

I smell troll.

Larry Hotchkiss 06-11-2011 01:01 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Eichmann (Post 945869)
I do probably consume more than what my BMR states but wouldn't eating more be counterproductive?

BMR is the amount of calories needed to support life if you laid in bed all day. If thats not what you are doing than you need to eat more, plain and simple.

Terry Gibbs 06-12-2011 06:39 PM

Re: Plateauing....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by David Hansen (Post 946391)
I smell troll.

was wondering how anyone can possible have been doing this (weights, crossfit, general fitness, health )for 7 years and be in his position...


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