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-   -   5 3 1 + metcons (https://board.crossfit.com/showthread.php?t=67061)

Evan Peikon 05-10-2011 03:35 PM

5 3 1 + metcons
 
what are your views on 531? my goals are to gain strength, however i dont want to lose conditioning so i was thinking of adding metcons.
so my week would look something like this

m-dead lift (warm up sets/work sets/assistance excercises)
t-bench(Warmup sets/work sets/ assistance ex)
w-rest
t-press(warm up sets, work sets, assistance ex)
f-squat(warm up sets, work sets, assistance ex)
s-met con (versa climber sprints, or hill sprints etc)
s-rest
m-met con
t-deads etc repeat cycle

Matt Haxmeier 05-10-2011 04:23 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
I really like it. I basically do something similar to what you're suggesting. I can't say my conditioning has been increasing dramatically but my strength gains have been decent. And it's a fairly easy program to tweak since you can choose whatever assistance you wish. Sometimes we just choose a reasonable metcon for the assistance. Sometimes we just do the main lift and quit. Sometimes we do tons of assistance. It depends on your goals, recovery ability, etc. I feel like the metcons definitely get in the way of my strength gains, especially the more taxing ones. But keeping it to 2-3 fairly short ones per week seems to be sufficient.

I'm in Week 3 of 8th cycle
Bodyweight 185 to 199
SP: 120x10 to 157.5x6 (155x1 to 187.5x1)
DL: 265x10 to 350x8 (345x1 to 410x1)
BP: 170x12 to 230x10 (225x1 to 275x1)
BS: 225x8 to 330x6 (295x1 to 385x1)

Also new PR's:
Split Jerk 1x250
Clean 1x242.5
Weighted Ring Dip 1xbodyweight+100lbs
Behind the Neck Jerk 1x255
Push Press 1x225
Overhead Squat 1x225
Front Squat 20x175, 15x195, 1x285
500m Row 1:34
5k Row 20:34
Double Overhand Axle Deadlift: 245lbs
HSPU: 13 (after 400m run)

I've been satisfied with how it fits into a long term program. Low stress. Good variation.

Evan Peikon 05-10-2011 04:37 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
can you give me a sample of the type of metcon youd do as an assistance ex. and should i do short met cons after my 531 days or keep them to their own days?
ive never really done crossfit bc i just finished high school sports and am starting training on my own now. so i wanted to know what kind of met cons to do . so far the ones ive came up with involve interval on the vera climber

Evan Peikon 05-10-2011 04:52 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
and in regards to this program how does my diet look food wise and meal timing wise?

im 5'9 (125ish) eating paleo+dairy
6:00am
apple
2tbsp pb,1tbsp jelly
1 paleo stix
1 cup greek yogurt

10:00am-11:00am
4 oz chicken
1 pear
2 large carrots
1/4 cup almonds

2:00pm
2 eggs
prunes/appricots

6:30pm(diff every day)
4oz buffalo meat
large salas w/ grilled vegetables
or
4oz turkey
avocado
salad

9:30pm
1 cup 1%milk

Matt Haxmeier 05-10-2011 05:02 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
Well, in very general terms, you want a pulling motion and a pressing motion to compliment your lifts.

So for Bench Press or Shoulder Press you could do:
21-15-9
HSPU
Pullups

For Deadlifts & Back Squat day you can use some variation of pulling motions and squatting.

So maybe:
3 rounds:
Front Squat 135x10
Row 500m

I'm totally just throwing a couple out there. There are infinite possibilities there. The goal of accessory work is to help with your main lifts. Adding them into the metcon just allows you to kill two birds with one stone. It really just depends on what you need more work on, what your weak points are, your knowledge level, recovery, etc.

You could also just do hill sprints, prowler, sled work, like Wendler recommends.

I personally don't like doing strength work on the same day as my metcon. I feel like I do a half hearted attempt at both if I do that. What works for you may be totally different. If you're not very knowledgeable/experienced in creating your own programming you might want to try and simplify things while you figure out what's going on. Perhaps something like Starting Strength with 2 days of interval runs or no conditioning. It depends on your goals.

Matt Haxmeier 05-10-2011 05:13 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
[QUOTE=Evan Peikon;935154]and in regards to this program how does my diet look food wise and meal timing wise?

im 5'9 (125ish) eating paleo+dairy
[/QUOTE]

5'9 125ish? What are your goals like that causes you to be 125? My wife weighs that and is 5'3" (and squats about 180 and deadlifts 245).

At 125 you basically need to triple your food intake and start squatting and pressing every other day for a few months. Basically Starting Strength + triple your food + drinking a gallon of whole milk every day. Then when you come back 50lbs heavier you can start doing wods rx'd and worrying about intermediate strength programs like 5/3/1 is considered to be.

Wayne Riddle 05-10-2011 05:35 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
[QUOTE=Evan Peikon;935154]im 5'9 (125ish) eating paleo+dairy[/QUOTE]

Eat more...

Ditch the 1% milk for whole milk. I would suggest forgetting 5/3/1 for now and start with a linear progression program. Since you want to main some conditioning look at the 70's Big or Grey Skull LP programs.

Just my opinion.

Evan Peikon 05-10-2011 05:37 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
im that light becuase i ran 50+ miles a week for awhile, but im not longer an endurance athlete.
im working on gaining muscle and have been doing so succesfully. to start my lifts are light but im 17 and working on them so ill improve (dead-135, squat-125, bench-110,press-70)

as for assistance what ive been doing has been as follows:(i do these after my warm up and work sets obv)
dead- 5 sets of 10 reps @ 50%max deads, 5 sets of 10 reps glute ham raise
bench-5 sets of 10 reps @ 50%max bench, 5 sets of 10 reps dips
squat-5 sets of 10 reps @ 50%max squat, 5 sets 20 reps leg extension
press-5 sets of 10 reps @ 50%max press, 5 sets of 10 pullups

my metcons have been:
1) 100ft,200ft,300ft,400ft,400ft,300ft,200ft,100ft versa climb
2) Versa climb 2k afap
3) versa climb for max distance 15x1min

Matt Haxmeier 05-10-2011 07:16 PM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
5/3/1 is good for me because:
a.) I'm old
b.) and recover slowly (need deloads)
c.) and have been lifting awhile
d.) and have a good base and good form.
e.) and need to get stronger without gaining weight.
f.) can't limit my metcons because I'd just be a fat asthmatic without them.

Starting Strength is basically designed for people like you. So I still stick by this suggestion.

[QUOTE=Matt Haxmeier;935159]Basically Starting Strength + triple your food + drinking a gallon of whole milk every day. Then when you come back 50lbs heavier you can start doing wods rx'd and worrying about intermediate strength programs like 5/3/1 is considered to be.[/QUOTE]

Wayne Riddle 05-11-2011 03:14 AM

Re: 5 3 1 + metcons
 
What Matt said. My personal opinion is to pick up a copy of Starting Strength, read it a couple of times, make sure you understand the lifts and the programs (Practical Programming is a good book too), and follow the program till linear progression stops.


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